From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ej1-x632.google.com (mail-ej1-x632.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::632]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B17FE3B29E for ; Sun, 30 Oct 2022 23:27:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-ej1-x632.google.com with SMTP id k2so26390448ejr.2 for ; Sun, 30 Oct 2022 20:27:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=jackrabbitwireless.com; s=google; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=A1IGIl1PSobweM41S6oaTb8BOEYdzdfBrjmb+RuCLNI=; b=t2I/7FDGt3OuEk0xxgyioT7xfBnNEMq8djmMrIpge7ppr3Z9FBrhkz2uS6xPUDEj+E zqbu+w+8DUMI51KFHzouwgcY218z4u+FtwKlCeoDmLAHOBm62qquzZk58fwgxn7dOKtI audqu15dXSRwqNdDQyucw2i/VOEHZcOCceLrE= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=A1IGIl1PSobweM41S6oaTb8BOEYdzdfBrjmb+RuCLNI=; b=Ed/KcbB3/LE9JIp6/rwSR2JCUbwFpwXzJlhHThvwidj43dSUfYK7GGiZkHnTRujDjV KyAlfaymyfERLUK/Cpn5RJluglCKpsJIh67JdFfKwmYTSU5xJhZL79KdiqLsLLTB+TFp ZkfDTZ8g6TmBdubAie4BLKq4WgCYBiTdF69KvqS70DSvep33sK2IeC47yeNEMHWcwLfr L9eOnG49SfhsfhVOlnp1lCd8e/Put6kIfDPvyJoLWgkDLX6X3Wm9D2A3md1fPxCtlgJv NdtCsItkiOFQjRK238hMvrprZdxQnXUEgM3ThDgjPaPOlmlBEbGyCDwoDxgyUltHB9lg RBMA== X-Gm-Message-State: ACrzQf1bDXBu0H6Rxf0DaIWPSq4WV61doDR7cikwv2yvHWqbYPQ/fEP6 VDsJl93UJjtKdo65f68eUXIN7CmxVoVrczrxDe8FsA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMsMyM7xir4VEMhQnotu73K6r6GUdJ9FwB5LPGd0jFGOWOk+ecwXCqIEmhBgDwo43pNPKXSH4h5q2oiz0SFMjc4yPrY= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:5dae:b0:78e:3109:36d1 with SMTP id n14-20020a1709065dae00b0078e310936d1mr10985649ejv.470.1667186826708; Sun, 30 Oct 2022 20:27:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: =?UTF-8?Q?Robert_Chac=C3=B3n?= Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2022 21:26:55 -0600 Message-ID: To: Dave Taht Cc: Herbert Wolverson , libreqos Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000094a03905ec4c2e90" Subject: Re: [LibreQoS] Integration system, aka fun with graph theory X-BeenThere: libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Many ISPs need the kinds of quality shaping cake can do List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2022 03:27:07 -0000 --00000000000094a03905ec4c2e90 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > That's a lot to play with, so I'm taking my time. My gut likes the A/B switch, currently. Take your time, I'm just thrilled to see this working so well so far. > I could feel the difference at my desk; fire up a video while a download was running, and it simply "felt" like it responded better. TCP RTT times are the best measure of "feel" I've found, so far. I've experienced the same when our network switched from LibreQoS using fq_codel to LibreQoS using CAKE. Really hard to quantify it but the "snappiness" or "feel" is noticeable to end-users. > We've tended to go with "median" latency as a guide, rather than mean. Thanks to monitoring things beyond our control, some of the outliers tend to be *really bad* - even if the network is fine. There's literally nothing we can do about a customer trying to work with a malfunctioning system somewhere (in space, for all I know!) True. And it can be sort of helpful for troubleshooting WiFi latency issues and bottlenecks inside the home and such. > "monitor only" mode Perhaps we can use ePPing just for this aspect? Or instead we could use cpumap-pping but with all HTB classes set to high rates (no plan enforcement) and no CAKE leafs. > How about the idea of "metaverse-ready" metrics, with one table that is preseem-like and another that's Good idea. I've now added both a standard (preseem like) table and "metaverse-ready" table of Node (AP) TCP Latency on the InfluxDB template. On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 8:21 PM Dave Taht via LibreQoS < libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > How about the idea of "metaverse-ready" metrics, with one table that is > preseem-like and another that's > > blue =3D < 8ms > green =3D < 20ms > yellow =3D < 50ms > orange =3D < 70ms > red =3D > 70ms > > _______________________________________________ > LibreQoS mailing list > LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos > --=20 Robert Chac=C3=B3n CEO | JackRabbit Wireless LLC Dev | LibreQoS.io --00000000000094a03905ec4c2e90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> That's a lot to play with, so I'm taking= my time. My gut likes the A/B switch, currently.

= Take your time, I'm just thrilled to see this working so well so far.

> I could feel the difference at my desk; fire = up a video while a=20 download was running, and it simply "felt" like it responded bett= er. TCP RTT times are the best measure of "feel" I've found, so far.=

I've experienced the same when our network sw= itched from LibreQoS using fq_codel to LibreQoS using CAKE. Really hard to = quantify it but the "snappiness" or "feel" is noticeabl= e to end-users.

> We've tended to go with &= quot;median" latency as a guide, rather than mean.=20 Thanks to monitoring things beyond our control, some of the outliers=20 tend to be really bad - even if the network is fine. There's=20 literally nothing we can do about a customer trying to work with a=20 malfunctioning system somewhere (in space, for all I know!)

<= /div>
True. And it can be sort of helpful for troubleshooting WiFi late= ncy issues and bottlenecks inside the home and such.

> "monitor only" mode

Perhap= s we can use ePPing just for this aspect? Or instead we could use cpumap-pp= ing but with all HTB classes set to high rates (no plan enforcement) and no= CAKE leafs.

> How about the idea of "= metaverse-ready" metrics, with one table that is preseem-like and anot= her that's

Good idea. I've now added both a = standard (preseem like) table and "metaverse-ready" table of Node= (AP) TCP Latency on the InfluxDB template.

<= div>

On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 8:21 PM Dave Taht via LibreQoS <= libreqos@lists.bufferbloa= t.net> wrote:
How about the idea of "metaverse-ready"= ; metrics, with one table that is preseem-like and another that's

blue =3D=C2=A0 < 8ms
green =3D < 20= ms
yellow =3D < 50ms
orange=C2=A0 =3D < 70ms
red =3D > 70ms

_______________________________________________
LibreQoS mailing list
LibreQo= S@lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos


--
Robert Chac=C3=B3n

--00000000000094a03905ec4c2e90--