* [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published...
@ 2018-06-05 22:03 Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2018-06-05 22:23 ` Dave Taht
2018-06-07 10:38 ` Pete Heist
0 siblings, 2 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2018-06-05 22:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: make-wifi-fast
https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=8359288
They change buffer sizes (but dynamically!) and manage to do better than
Linux with CoDel and PIE as qdiscs on the WiFi interface. Linux 3.17.7,
that is. This was published today...
What's worse is that they actually cite our paper, with this comment:
> Recently, Høiland-Jørgensen et al. [20] also tackled bufferbloat in
> APs with the goal to reduce latency and improve airtime fairness.
> Their proposal was built on top of FQ-CoDel which is one of the
> queuing disciplines in Linux. We believe that the mesh environment
> imposes further challenges that are not addressed in this work.
I am mildly outraged...
-Toke
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published...
2018-06-05 22:03 [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2018-06-05 22:23 ` Dave Taht
2018-06-05 22:31 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2018-06-07 10:38 ` Pete Heist
1 sibling, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Dave Taht @ 2018-06-05 22:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: Make-Wifi-fast
well, are the results correct?
On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 3:03 PM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@toke.dk> wrote:
> https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=8359288
>
> They change buffer sizes (but dynamically!) and manage to do better than
> Linux with CoDel and PIE as qdiscs on the WiFi interface. Linux 3.17.7,
> that is. This was published today...
>
> What's worse is that they actually cite our paper, with this comment:
>
>> Recently, Høiland-Jørgensen et al. [20] also tackled bufferbloat in
>> APs with the goal to reduce latency and improve airtime fairness.
>> Their proposal was built on top of FQ-CoDel which is one of the
>> queuing disciplines in Linux. We believe that the mesh environment
>> imposes further challenges that are not addressed in this work.
>
> I am mildly outraged...
>
> -Toke
> _______________________________________________
> Make-wifi-fast mailing list
> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast
--
Dave Täht
CEO, TekLibre, LLC
http://www.teklibre.com
Tel: 1-669-226-2619
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published...
2018-06-05 22:23 ` Dave Taht
@ 2018-06-05 22:31 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2018-06-05 22:49 ` Dave Taht
0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen @ 2018-06-05 22:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Dave Taht; +Cc: Make-Wifi-fast
Whaddyamean correct? They don't actually test against our work, if that's what you mean...
On 6 June 2018 00:23:02 CEST, Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
>well, are the results correct?
>
>On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 3:03 PM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@toke.dk>
>wrote:
>> https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=8359288
>>
>> They change buffer sizes (but dynamically!) and manage to do better
>than
>> Linux with CoDel and PIE as qdiscs on the WiFi interface. Linux
>3.17.7,
>> that is. This was published today...
>>
>> What's worse is that they actually cite our paper, with this comment:
>>
>>> Recently, Høiland-Jørgensen et al. [20] also tackled bufferbloat in
>>> APs with the goal to reduce latency and improve airtime fairness.
>>> Their proposal was built on top of FQ-CoDel which is one of the
>>> queuing disciplines in Linux. We believe that the mesh environment
>>> imposes further challenges that are not addressed in this work.
>>
>> I am mildly outraged...
>>
>> -Toke
>> _______________________________________________
>> Make-wifi-fast mailing list
>> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published...
2018-06-05 22:31 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
@ 2018-06-05 22:49 ` Dave Taht
0 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Dave Taht @ 2018-06-05 22:49 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: Make-Wifi-fast
well, we can write the publisher a letter.
On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 3:31 PM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@toke.dk> wrote:
> Whaddyamean correct? They don't actually test against our work, if that's what you mean...
>
> On 6 June 2018 00:23:02 CEST, Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
>>well, are the results correct?
>>
>>On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 3:03 PM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@toke.dk>
>>wrote:
>>> https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=8359288
>>>
>>> They change buffer sizes (but dynamically!) and manage to do better
>>than
>>> Linux with CoDel and PIE as qdiscs on the WiFi interface. Linux
>>3.17.7,
>>> that is. This was published today...
>>>
>>> What's worse is that they actually cite our paper, with this comment:
>>>
>>>> Recently, Høiland-Jørgensen et al. [20] also tackled bufferbloat in
>>>> APs with the goal to reduce latency and improve airtime fairness.
>>>> Their proposal was built on top of FQ-CoDel which is one of the
>>>> queuing disciplines in Linux. We believe that the mesh environment
>>>> imposes further challenges that are not addressed in this work.
>>>
>>> I am mildly outraged...
>>>
>>> -Toke
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Make-wifi-fast mailing list
>>> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast
--
Dave Täht
CEO, TekLibre, LLC
http://www.teklibre.com
Tel: 1-669-226-2619
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published...
2018-06-05 22:03 [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2018-06-05 22:23 ` Dave Taht
@ 2018-06-07 10:38 ` Pete Heist
2018-06-07 11:54 ` Jonathan Morton
1 sibling, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Pete Heist @ 2018-06-07 10:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen; +Cc: make-wifi-fast
> On Jun 6, 2018, at 12:03 AM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@toke.dk> wrote:
>
> https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=8359288
>
> They change buffer sizes (but dynamically!) and manage to do better than
> Linux with CoDel and PIE as qdiscs on the WiFi interface. Linux 3.17.7,
> that is. This was published today…
Just after a quick read, I fail to see how just decreasing buffer sizes is going to be “better”. Better than just throwing fq_codel on the wireless interface, maybe.
In regards to CoDel and PIE, they say "both of these schemes never consider frame aggregation in the buffer sizing decision.” Isn’t the whole point of CoDel that one doesn’t need to be concerned with buffer size as long as it’s “large enough”?
> What's worse is that they actually cite our paper, with this comment:
>
>> Recently, Høiland-Jørgensen et al. [20] also tackled bufferbloat in
>> APs with the goal to reduce latency and improve airtime fairness.
>> Their proposal was built on top of FQ-CoDel which is one of the
>> queuing disciplines in Linux. We believe that the mesh environment
>> imposes further challenges that are not addressed in this work.
That’s arm waving that really misrepresents the work without even testing it.
> I am mildly outraged…
Is there a better place to respond than adding a comment to the article?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published...
2018-06-07 10:38 ` Pete Heist
@ 2018-06-07 11:54 ` Jonathan Morton
0 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Jonathan Morton @ 2018-06-07 11:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Pete Heist; +Cc: Toke Høiland-Jørgensen, make-wifi-fast
> On 7 Jun, 2018, at 1:38 pm, Pete Heist <pete@eventide.io> wrote:
>
> Just after a quick read, I fail to see how just decreasing buffer sizes is going to be “better”. Better than just throwing fq_codel on the wireless interface, maybe.
Not even that. They're not testing it against fq_codel, only "dumb oversized FIFO", plain Codel, plain PIE. They've completely missed out any consideration of flow, host or station isolation.
I can certainly see why Toke is annoyed.
- Jonathan Morton
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2018-06-07 11:54 UTC | newest]
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2018-06-05 22:03 [Make-wifi-fast] I have no idea how this got published Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2018-06-05 22:23 ` Dave Taht
2018-06-05 22:31 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2018-06-05 22:49 ` Dave Taht
2018-06-07 10:38 ` Pete Heist
2018-06-07 11:54 ` Jonathan Morton
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