From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wm0-x241.google.com (mail-wm0-x241.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::241]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 310AD3B2A4; Fri, 9 Dec 2016 07:37:58 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-wm0-x241.google.com with SMTP id g23so3817911wme.1; Fri, 09 Dec 2016 04:37:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id:references :to; bh=avmROFzNZRiziNnu+aFzxzj00K+EUxtIj0gHgadkgqY=; b=folVMxzLtwwZSrzDY420g1v9hzIRsDrDCwBmsOnGFXy+wI+ZImDVFjLhdmWq84xp9f 04koHlBlkZvJutDk9QKSHScI9gXilcUCqe/ZVKVr3hxdqhGNlO04hWxjnbbgFome1vVb D0T82Cy8F1XiCmJ2QftEnnhNgO70JhH0OWUs07FrFJMqN7ilmp6cuJvTMKe+qgRWfg8a 8P2BCEFNkJpYC3Lna3s0SD/nRRls9IpHBJbTnCJq2auTp1+iTj5I8KTXs8yITiUxm0A0 KKsjwtCSUv1vJn49/GtGK+NagO+8Ua8TYRLyI8Vg1dkqStBFFxqfXwZus5CMv1iaYA/s FiPQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :message-id:references:to; bh=avmROFzNZRiziNnu+aFzxzj00K+EUxtIj0gHgadkgqY=; b=KTquanAqrNe1sBF2G8ATwpnSPzN07i5GgP2lx+lZcwaTk++32aiv7JOAOTsxqgBIs9 j4erNWHUT/WcYbLZ7PyijPYZPkq5kP4nJkCiqMgQ5gn+x3vGtvJ5Ek/oMIyHNRnWNR2f cOFRKsDvtASSnFLSy1jkamc9tzsJG8UAnTv38wrbNtt15UUouQ0qIuBbPGqzRX6zvV3z iqJ20QWJyBbPV9ruj5gcya9nFJmG6EsQccuSxP/Ib0degaVdFIihAhDHJeUIsFJ1+R4r q7ZCM5Fs1Wv/U+vnwtkp9JjSKW9kIBhm4Tcu+ZSXl38lDb1k0YfU7R0ufQ8BYSHK2jZa FY1Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AKaTC00Ez5GoDMS6aLq47G+pe81R9EFHSaX0eIbAI5fPaW+eCNNwSBIs6fLF9ziwfqSYdw== X-Received: by 10.28.19.196 with SMTP id 187mr7224910wmt.81.1481287076978; Fri, 09 Dec 2016 04:37:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.72.0.34] (h-1169.lbcfree.net. [185.99.119.68]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ef10sm42070948wjd.22.2016.12.09.04.37.56 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 09 Dec 2016 04:37:56 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_2442162D-D0DC-4668-8709-5DFCCC53A3CF" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) From: Phineas Gage In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2016 13:37:55 +0100 Cc: codel@lists.bufferbloat.net, make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net Message-Id: <5EA3C6E6-76C7-4347-9B14-3C310271A8FD@gmail.com> References: <9BA0F7D8-5A25-4033-A101-38BF001B74EB@gmail.com> To: Jonathan Morton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] Software rate limiting with fq_codel for point-to-point WiFi backhaul links X-BeenThere: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2016 12:37:58 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_2442162D-D0DC-4668-8709-5DFCCC53A3CF Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Ok, I had not realized that, thanks. :) I=E2=80=99ve not seen this done anywhere, has anyone tried it? Otherwise = I=E2=80=99ll give it a try and write back what I find. In this case, the throughput for the backhaul links =E2=80=9Cshould=E2=80=9D= be mostly stable, and we=E2=80=99ll just accept any variation as =E2=80=9C= no worse than before=E2=80=9D. It's true, I also want to try Cake (anywhere I wrote fq_codel that could = be substituted with Cake), and I see from here = (https://www.bufferbloat.net/projects/codel/wiki/Cake/#installing-cake-out= -of-tree-on-linux = ) that it should work on the 3.16.7 kernel I need to = target. Voyage Linux doesn=E2=80=99t install with kernel sources, but I = should be able to get that compiled with their SDK. > On Dec 9, 2016, at 12:39 PM, Jonathan Morton = wrote: >=20 >> On 9 Dec, 2016, at 12:12, Phineas Gage wrote: >>=20 >> Given the half-duplex nature of 802.11 WiFi, is it possible to use = fq_codel with software rate limiting on separate hardware from the WiFi = radio, while still allowing at or near the full WiFi link rate? >=20 > Given that you can=E2=80=99t reliably predict the actual wifi = throughput from userspace, and that it will vary over time due to = external interference and path attenuation, that would be difficult. >=20 > However, you *can* loop both the ingress and egress traffic through a = common IFB interface, and shape that - using Cake, even. That sounds = like what you=E2=80=99re trying to experiment with. >=20 > - Jonathan Morton >=20 --Apple-Mail=_2442162D-D0DC-4668-8709-5DFCCC53A3CF Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Ok, I had not realized that, thanks. = :)

I=E2=80=99ve = not seen this done anywhere, has anyone tried it? Otherwise I=E2=80=99ll = give it a try and write back what I find.

In this case, the throughput for the = backhaul links =E2=80=9Cshould=E2=80=9D be mostly stable, and we=E2=80=99l= l just accept any variation as =E2=80=9Cno worse than = before=E2=80=9D.

It's true, I also want to try Cake (anywhere I wrote fq_codel = that could be substituted with Cake), and I see from here (https://www.bufferbloat.net/projects/codel/wiki/Cake/#installin= g-cake-out-of-tree-on-linux) that it should work on the 3.16.7 = kernel I need to target. Voyage Linux doesn=E2=80=99t install with = kernel sources, but I should be able to get that compiled with their = SDK.

On Dec 9, 2016, at 12:39 PM, Jonathan Morton <chromatix99@gmail.com> wrote:

On 9 Dec, = 2016, at 12:12, Phineas Gage <phineas919@gmail.com> wrote:

Given the half-duplex nature of 802.11 WiFi, is it possible = to use fq_codel with software rate limiting on separate hardware from = the WiFi radio, while still allowing at or near the full WiFi link = rate?

Given that you can=E2=80=99= t reliably predict the actual wifi throughput from userspace, and that = it will vary over time due to external interference and path = attenuation, that would be difficult.

However, you *can* loop both the ingress and egress traffic = through a common IFB interface, and shape that - using Cake, even. =  That sounds like what you=E2=80=99re trying to experiment with.

- Jonathan Morton


= --Apple-Mail=_2442162D-D0DC-4668-8709-5DFCCC53A3CF--