From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from us-smtp-1.mimecast.com (us-smtp-2.mimecast.com [205.139.110.61]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CF3483B29D for ; Tue, 23 Jun 2020 06:11:15 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=redhat.com; s=mimecast20190719; t=1592907075; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=sx1CRTrqC93teJ4AwYXQLh6EzGNqzhB3NqgpyiOxcFE=; b=SWAht6R/Qkpn+TbzPxe1GSLGg/EpWJG8zTzhv2IL/1LONsq37sR0ESheSXfkX/ibMmP/oY 1dlLchEHtg4GVC9FWSjc+mrK+M3sa4yXoo4G1oeNulD6W0zSunj1QRCJ/kbfGmRF/MF9kO V9JKrXm8x6cbDZykVrVyUg0JnBgjL5M= Received: from mail-wm1-f72.google.com (mail-wm1-f72.google.com [209.85.128.72]) (Using TLS) by relay.mimecast.com with ESMTP id us-mta-12-453VGOdpMSi1EMSVnx0IBQ-1; Tue, 23 Jun 2020 06:11:13 -0400 X-MC-Unique: 453VGOdpMSi1EMSVnx0IBQ-1 Received: by mail-wm1-f72.google.com with SMTP id p24so3295840wma.4 for ; Tue, 23 Jun 2020 03:11:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:mime-version; bh=sx1CRTrqC93teJ4AwYXQLh6EzGNqzhB3NqgpyiOxcFE=; b=FKYurXJc6j50vwFJOG3hMnEv3zYaoW5nafeQDFjHhM3cNHBEV3bJJFMzMkzsSXtpoV hge7+TdRAZcw3iFrdL37tMKp8UK6TYMsa7NdBqqI7uG56+Cmq6t9IwoPF+3ZE7r0fS3x 2H149DhWbgGaKCOdkAPfJd/e79PnLBw2zGSfvrOJITVa6I4TfyQ1svp+XYVu6uScbDbk 3d/Jn1uBOguGjIV4/apNAHK0oSZAYbWz0cUCXLFp7bYLRizWQc6QQXfouS+zHrq1Pilv VJANqQ4DafnL+2M5RHkVUgTLmiLW1DdziWuGg/3ZcgtR8BeLpeJV9+TZBrDTgmFH/8mV nfpg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533ffiHpzrnYKtRdJcw4BvslJXnH57GI2m846upBeOYJV149+D6d YY0yRXyF2lw2rHIxNZVLRpqzr92pSkMtj819BwoUN4IpdsrY/IBRVlZ84LGOdZZHBvlYTuYl8Or 3ab9VMvhWw2fmXNGtnrF284mwBzgfGuhyjk8= X-Received: by 2002:a1c:63c2:: with SMTP id x185mr23616240wmb.68.1592907071777; Tue, 23 Jun 2020 03:11:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz1vKwHPibfDZhqAcQ40IBAQkXNbG0Y6yKZXVNep8+W6WCgWKnxD9fmT7J9ranvfH2XcggZmw== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:63c2:: with SMTP id x185mr23616215wmb.68.1592907071490; Tue, 23 Jun 2020 03:11:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alrua-x1.borgediget.toke.dk ([2a0c:4d80:42:443::2]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id u74sm3186973wmu.31.2020.06.23.03.11.10 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 23 Jun 2020 03:11:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: by alrua-x1.borgediget.toke.dk (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 20010181502; Tue, 23 Jun 2020 12:11:10 +0200 (CEST) From: Toke =?utf-8?Q?H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen?= To: Michael Yartys , Simon Barber Cc: "make-wifi-fast\@lists.bufferbloat.net" In-Reply-To: References: <87tuz3tgaq.fsf@toke.dk> X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2020 12:11:10 +0200 Message-ID: <87o8part1d.fsf@toke.dk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Authentication-Results: relay.mimecast.com; auth=pass smtp.auth=CUSA124A263 smtp.mailfrom=toke@redhat.com X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0 X-Mimecast-Originator: redhat.com Content-Type: text/plain Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] Bufferbloat on Norwegian train wifi X-BeenThere: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2020 10:11:15 -0000 Michael Yartys writes: > Wow, those are some truly crappy networks! Yeah, 'bloat-bragging' seems to have become quite the sport on these mailing lists ;) > I'll try to contact Vy to get them to do something about it. I wonder > how much of this might be due to the equipment on their trains though. > I decided to measure the bufferbloat on the LTE network in my > neighbourhood, and on average I got 300 ms above baseline while > running an 8-stream TCP download. Then again, I ran this test with my > phone acting as a hotspot, and the results might be affected by that. > Does anybody know if this methodology produces reliable results? I > presume that even the very short peak of 86 Mbps shouldn't really > cause much WiFi-related bufferbloat. Hard to say from first principles. 300ms doesn't sound unrealistic for bloat on an LTE network and if you have a good WiFi connection on your phone the WiFI link *shouldn't* be a bottleneck. But it's hard to know for sure; just too many variables. I guess you could try running a speedtest on your phone while you have a ping running from your tethered laptop. Not sure how effective the app-based speedtests are at inducing bloat, though; they're certanly not measuring it... -Toke