From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-qt0-x22f.google.com (mail-qt0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c0d::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E4EF83B29E for ; Wed, 17 May 2017 20:20:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-qt0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id t26so22894969qtg.0 for ; Wed, 17 May 2017 17:20:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=FKxpMHI4ITcMnVUuioJD5+1pNMwRW4kx/V5yJyvn1lc=; b=TETp/RCLFo9hAVIYreSyJz4dbpq8xwiKYzlGzY1BK14fPdtR7uVWqmqqzow9NSn+y/ UEX689RIuPCow7NzwkyeLIw3g+WBrYqUe4RIOL8yl5ZEkk3H5CJZq5UfS1Y8F5uwJXF4 6tnMjYei7tEpVPFOtaJk/Ehxc7vxdtYV/SOoTt1wmv4Ww1nWdMV5X44l69S5GNAJv0ax pkoZGMldpI0HxJdybrt7zcSSP1+fydYThnIfkWv285rLDMZZqF7L96Z/FHm/PBKTukp3 cS0yYsLOFF8hCTLVskRNgG36W/TcLdvK1hP4ZiZktz6VlmiLWd0uMyIAZcRcEPgi9srB yI8g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=FKxpMHI4ITcMnVUuioJD5+1pNMwRW4kx/V5yJyvn1lc=; b=pdvIk2vzJrgfbmXUAzujjwzXaxV40U1jKG1VBlEqaXZZZWTd3edXGscwc8bM0iCfH6 2tc4NVEp4kMsZTV2Rs6fMYRpSOZ1PpFYAv/6GrwbRnenivRAPyOIs95eLHHLvpzBZZCo bWSul03hEDAPTwMC7RbfjtLaALjeegvVYMaahO6ejHFBPJU2Qc8ZQXBDpVsZSi0lZH4e OJr7zXvbFPpRzgK1fCL8X1zuvpuMgKLtF7+94TuHFHPkzBzCidIstU0PEhEwMPmfKARn pvU9X4hacqHQnOEyhxEDqrCmcq5iOWNM0IXCfVo4fhrkqmxW9xv+EJ4JpeOujGs42t9D YiRw== X-Gm-Message-State: AODbwcCJkny5WG1Ibny1v7nuJP7Ki5SobTmnoGoyH7i4d7sAa0+lh4lT PW4VPSFDTKiUxn2dZ5U= X-Received: by 10.237.37.81 with SMTP id w17mr1564084qtc.8.1495066804349; Wed, 17 May 2017 17:20:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from richs-mbp-10106.lan ([64.223.233.172]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id e70sm2599061qkj.28.2017.05.17.17.20.03 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 17 May 2017 17:20:03 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: Rich Brown In-Reply-To: <028001d2cd0f$afb27f40$0f177dc0$@riepnet.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2017 20:20:02 -0400 Cc: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <028001d2cd0f$afb27f40$0f177dc0$@riepnet.com> To: Frits Riep X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] Make-wifi-fast Digest, Vol 26, Issue 2 - Thanks and question on whether the Make-wifi-fast code is in the Ubiquiti wireless implementation. X-BeenThere: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 May 2017 00:20:05 -0000 Frits, The IQrouter actually ships with self-configuring code on top of the = LEDE software. It initially checks bandwidth to adjust the SQM = parameters, and also seems to check continually, to account for = daily/nightly variations that may occur. (I don't have certain knowledge = of this, but they've said things that make me think it...) I absolutely agree that it would be good to have more commercial vendors = adopt this technology, so we can seek out different dragons to slay... Best, Rich > On May 14, 2017, at 8:10 PM, Frits Riep wrote: >=20 > Rich, I'd like to thank and acknowledge the excellent work done by = yourself and all the technical contributors. >=20 > I've been using and benefiting from the good work done on my routers = using fq-codel and cake as well, mostly on a TP-Link Archer C7 with = OpenWRT and LEDE builds, and that has worked well to control latency on = my internet connection. >=20 > I've also been a fan of the Ubiquiti Unifi wireless products and have = used them at home and for many small business customers. I have noted = that they have implemented Airtime fairness and that is great. >=20 > Per your note below stating some of the results, in particular I am = unclear on "- A few commercial products - notably IQrouter and Ubiquiti = - are shipping a good SQM implementation in their products" I do know = that Ubiquiti has implemented SQM in their routers, but I have not used = their routers, but I am very interested if the Unifi AP's have = implemented any Make-wifi-fast code, because I have not seen any = references to that in their release notes or in other sources. Also, = there do not appear to be any settings in their management interface to = enable or configure any SQM, fq-codel, or Cake configuration settings, = so I would think there is no Make-wifi-fast code in their current or = beta wireless implementations. They do have "Airtime Fairness" and = that has been great, but I do not know if that is due to using = Make-wifi-fast code, or their own implementation. >=20 > I am interested in any insights you can provide on this, and also in = general whether any commercial products have or are planning to = implement Make-wifi-fast. It would be great to see this be = implemented in many commercial products so that this ultimately benefits = all end-users and becomes a marketing advantage for manufacturers to = help spur implementation. >=20 > Thanks, > Frits=20 >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: Make-wifi-fast = [mailto:make-wifi-fast-bounces@lists.bufferbloat.net] On Behalf Of = make-wifi-fast-request@lists.bufferbloat.net > Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2017 12:00 PM > To: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > Subject: Make-wifi-fast Digest, Vol 26, Issue 2 >=20 > Send Make-wifi-fast mailing list submissions to > make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net >=20 > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > make-wifi-fast-request@lists.bufferbloat.net >=20 > You can reach the person managing the list at > make-wifi-fast-owner@lists.bufferbloat.net >=20 > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific = than "Re: Contents of Make-wifi-fast digest..." >=20 >=20 > Today's Topics: >=20 > 1. Re: fq_codel is *five* years old today (Rich Brown) >=20 >=20 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >=20 > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 14 May 2017 08:31:57 -0400 > From: Rich Brown > To: "Richard E. Brown" > Cc: bloat , cerowrt-devel > , > make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net, codel > > Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] fq_codel is *five* years old today > Message-ID: <612E36A6-7FB8-4FBA-AC38-339DFC04AB47@gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dutf-8 >=20 > There have been so many improvements in so many ways... >=20 > - Cake is the acknowledged winner in SQM >=20 > - Make Wi-Fi Fast has removed a couple orders of magnitude of latency = in the Wi-Fi stack, and Airtime Fairness has eliminated the Wi-Fi = Paradox. >=20 > - All this is Implemented in LEDE, so it's available as a (somewhat) = straightforward install on hundreds of different kinds of routers. As a = side note, LEDE and OpenWrt are working toward a merger, with a = unification of the development efforts. >=20 > - A few commercial products - notably IQrouter and Ubiquiti - are = shipping a good SQM implementation in their products.=20 >=20 > Let's all take a moment and revel in solving some of the major = annoyances in networking. >=20 > Best regards, >=20 > Rich >=20 >> On May 14, 2016, at 9:18 AM, Rich Brown = wrote: >>=20 >> Another year, further progress toward world domination (or at least,=20= >> fixing the world's internet...) >>=20 >> - The team is working furiously on Making Wi-Fi Fast. This has = entailed lots of deep research into the behavior of Wi-Fi at low and = high loads, airtime fairness, wireless drivers, new hardware platforms = for testing. Lots more work ahead. >>=20 >> - We had a huge response (260 signers) to the Save Wi-Fi from the FCC = filing re: locking down OTS router firmware. >>=20 >> - We have officially declared the CeroWrt project to be dead. All its = interesting facilities have been subsumed into OpenWrt mainline code. >>=20 >> - The OpenWrt project has a fork - LEDE (http://lede-project.org) It = remains to be seen what effect this will have on our anti-Bufferbloat = effort. >>=20 >> - RIP: the original www.bufferbloat.net server. Hopefully someone can = pick up the pieces (even for historical purposes) as we re-deploy the = information to a new (non-Redmine) system. >>=20 >> What else happened this year? >>=20 >> Best regards, >>=20 >> Rich >>=20 >>> Begin forwarded message: >>>=20 >>> From: Rich Brown >>> Subject: fq_codel is *three* years old today >>> Date: May 14, 2015 at 8:11:38 AM EDT >>> To: bloat , cerowrt-devel=20 >>> >>> Cc: Justin Beech >>>=20 >>> Folks, >>>=20 >>> Today is the third anniversary of the announcement of a testable=20 >>> fq_codel (see=20 >>> = https://lists.bufferbloat.net/pipermail/cerowrt-devel/2014-May/002984 >>> .html et. seq.) >>>=20 >>> Here's (an approximation of) the state of the world: >>>=20 >>> - We didn't know it at the time, but we would be able to declare = victory on CeroWrt less than three months later with the 3.10.50-1 = build. Not only did that firmware reduce bufferbloat, but it showed that = DNSSEC and IPv6 could be implemented in "normal" home routers without = any kind of jiggery-pokery. Field reports at the end of 2014 showed that = build was very stable - we had lots of reports of 80 day uptimes, and a = high of ~140 days. >>>=20 >>> - fq_codel is installed a large and growing of places. It's = available off the shelf for OpenWrt in the SQM QoS package, the Linux = kernel, IPFire, DD-WRT, and other routers. >>>=20 >>> - "Bufferbloat" is entering the lexicon. People are speaking about = it=20 >>> in blogs and open literature as a known entity, not some voodoo=20 >>> effect that's only a concern to crazy people. The writers don't=20 >>> always get the description or symptoms right, but there is an=20 >>> acknowledgement that something could be better in your home (and=20 >>> everywhere) network connection. (See for example,=20 >>> = http://www.internetsociety.org/blog/tech-matters/2015/04/measure-your >>> -bufferbloat-new-browser-based-tool-dslreports ) >>>=20 >>> - Speaking of which, the new DSLReports Speed Test has recently=20 >>> stirred things up. Not only do we have an attractive tool that we = can=20 >>> recommend to friends, but people are getting a little hot under the=20= >>> collar when they see the crummy performance of the router that they=20= >>> just paid dearly for. See, for example,=20 >>> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r30051856-Connectivity-Buffer-Bloat >>>=20 >>> - Now that we've shown that fq_codel conquers bufferbloat, we're = finding further optimizations. There's a lot of effort on cake, which = promises to bring higher speed processing, and looking into corner cases = that can be improved.=20 >>>=20 >>> - And of course, Dave T=C3=A4ht is taking on another big project: = "Making Wi-Fi Fast". >>>=20 >>> What else has happened in this year? >>>=20 >>> Best, >>>=20 >>> Rich >>=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > ------------------------------ >=20 > Subject: Digest Footer >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Make-wifi-fast mailing list > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast >=20 > ------------------------------ >=20 > End of Make-wifi-fast Digest, Vol 26, Issue 2 > ********************************************* >=20