From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ed1-x532.google.com (mail-ed1-x532.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::532]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3A8063B2A4 for ; Sun, 9 Jan 2022 18:41:18 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-ed1-x532.google.com with SMTP id w16so46704359edc.11 for ; Sun, 09 Jan 2022 15:41:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=f7QTf/mcYdYFQacqk21qaw25fH5S3nrzUGlyNxRpToI=; b=pBLAxsbbG2r14MlnHoC0OkK7MdH+bSzG7gDbK0dGu6Dnzae/KNrEKViK6AoAOjcmdR FtPzCWdvOr2ImvFXVttq2S7aXVtH2dgr4jt0yKH8zBOBVVO5ajFW4p9J7cHNgPjLEa53 hjUpGILa8qcRdg3ER0Q3xjyzBNWNXfafe7biRRujtdx/OPsTCBrfQP+X5YjIw3Oo497g V9iNLETL5mCvXJHAiaDo13PgwnIM705pZ2y7A49sDzKsL4oiHFI1v0QklLHYdleqg2sf UBZqG5VZI8dzQQBhe/uh720lDBGgAoxW6w70RTKGS71GGeSYW4VwSCG92M+2DIlhW7jz P6Hg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=f7QTf/mcYdYFQacqk21qaw25fH5S3nrzUGlyNxRpToI=; b=oAcsaAC9+xaFRywrJfHS0Rkd0Xme5Y+4HNq6Lf9cU1ttbv68Kq3wQrn2laGZKHtBuB Fw2PE+SkyAM2701HihJAKhpaTP//lGesbqtDaF+YzDVSIS5JnsqKrOWb7cQcP4sBP2rG o9i4TAXUaBR8e/gLD6/lfv8JDuRiPa9Q/eNE1nFJPaNDjzRqXQr5C7u6PygAQZd+kN81 PtobsYOJqR9nY6QPOai7PuaXSMsbGdGRwBTkifw5cs+6L/U6kTuM1tBBlwJb1s24qMsY ZoVi7/YYzX6yqz7rEH8gmWDJNawB258carVylRGidcrau/xbaKkHVI4w0kGPS6mOrhQB ZZ4A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533HUVrvrEajaUuzcO/AToIYFBQRs3wKiqF5xJ0TzCSGsv+9clDk OnJJT1WQaWdcpzbHUSFdzeGh9o3o3EzaaeaKR98= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxcw92pBwNemfohV35ryibWyNWCZbhqMWasNTAla3kfouslcmIACfOEoNmxgDJfhrRJ4lmFR21FMa0KcpGTB54= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:eb50:: with SMTP id mc16mr10580290ejb.128.1641771676923; Sun, 09 Jan 2022 15:41:16 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87r19nb27v.fsf@toke.dk> <87k0febdaq.fsf@toke.dk> In-Reply-To: From: Dave Taht Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2022 15:41:04 -0800 Message-ID: To: Aaron Wood Cc: Sebastian Moeller , Make-Wifi-fast , Jon Pike Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] Upcoming WiFi standard to set per-flow DSCP values? X-BeenThere: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2022 23:41:18 -0000 I've tried to describe the side effects of using all 4 of these queues in nearly every talk. I'd really like it if the AP drivers just better multiplexed best effort traffic and modified the values in the beacon. I do see more value in pushing out queue selection to the clients, if used sparingly. On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 9:12 AM Aaron Wood wrote: > > I'm guessing that schemes like this are mostly aimed-at, or developed-by,= at the enterprise wifi market, where you have mixed uses being run on the = same AP (much like running separate vlans on the same wired network), to mi= x both "infrastructure" uses which have priority, and "guests" networks whi= ch have less priority. When I was in that part of the industry, I was seei= ng this a lot, the general attempt to move the QoS and vlans from wired net= works into WLAN and WAN links. > > On Wed, Jan 5, 2022 at 4:28 AM Sebastian Moeller wrote: >> >> Hi Toke, hi Jon, >> >> here is a corrected version of what I sent to another list (I accidental= ly converted the VA bit-pattern with my calculator set to base8 so decimal = 54 and Range7 instead of the correct decimal 44 and Range6, which does not = change much for the AC mapping as both range6 and 7 map to AC_VO): >> >> >> hostapd: add wmm qos map set by default >> >> author Felix Fietkau >> >> Wed, 3 Nov 2021 22:40:53 +0100 (22:40 +0100) >> >> committer Felix Fietkau >> >> Wed, 3 Nov 2021 22:47:55 +0100 (22:47 +0100) >> >> commit a5e3def1822431ef6436cb493df77006dbacafd6 >> >> tree f4494efd6e08a872524eedb5081564a6f5ece20c tree | snapshot >> >> parent b14f0628499142a718a68be7d1a7243f7f51ef0a commit |= diff >> >> hostapd: add wmm qos map set by default >> >> >> >> This implements the mapping recommendations from RFC8325, with an >> >> update from RFC8622. This ensures that DSCP marked packets are proper= ly >> >> sorted into WMM classes. >> >> The map can be disabled by setting iw_qos_map_set to something invali= d >> >> like 'none' >> >> >> >> Signed-off-by: Felix Fietkau >> > >> > Which introduces the following new RFC8325 inspired DSCP to AC mapping= s: >> > + set_default iw_qos_map_set 0,0,2,16,1,1,255,255,18,22,24,38,40= ,40,44,46,48,56 >> > >> > Which translates into the following mappings (according to the hostapd= rules below*): >> > >> > unraveling this gets us to (0 is coded as DSCP Exception, the rest as = DSCP ranges): >> > >> > UP DSCP AC PHBs(decDSCP) >> > Ex0 BE BE(0) BE/CS0(0) >> > Range0 2-16 BE CS1(8)**, AF11(10), AF12(12), AF13(14), = CS2(16) >> > Range1 1-1 BK LE(1) >> > Range2 - >> > Range3 18-22 BE AF21(18), AF22(20), AF23(22) >> > Range4 24-38 VI CS3(24), AF31(26), AF32(28), AF33(30), C= S4(32), AF41(34), AF42(36), AF43(38) >> > Range5 40-40 VI CS5(40) >> > Range6 44-46 VO VA(44), EF(46) >> > Range7 48-56 VO CS6(48), CS7(56) >> >> The kernel's default mappings, as far as https://wireless.wiki.kernel.or= g/en/developers/documentation/mac80211/queues states, seem driven by the to= p 3 bits of the DSCP field: >> RFC8325 also has a section about the default mappings >> >> UP DSCP AC PHBs(decDSCP) >> Range0 0-7 BE CS0(0) >> Range1 8-15 BK CS1(8), AF11(10), AF12(12), AF13(14) >> Range2 16-23 BK CS2(16), AF21(18), AF22(20), AF23(22) >> Range3 24-31 BE CS3(24), AF31(26), AF32(28), AF33(30) >> Range4 32-39 VI CS4(32), AF41(34), AF42(36), AF43(38) >> Range5 40-47 VI CS5(40), VA(44), EF(46) >> Range6 48-55 VO CS6(48) >> Range7 56-63 VO CS7(56) >> >> >> IMHO RFC8325 and the whole WMM scheme clearly lacks data showing that is= actually delivers on its promises. RFC8325 specifically seems obsessed in = changing mappings such that PHBs align with the 4 WMM queues, instead of in= terpreting the fact that the apparent mismatch between what the IETF thinks= about specific PHBs/DSCPs and how they are treated for most users, as clea= r sign, that reality does not care... (probably mostly driven by the elepha= nt in the room, of DSCPs not being end-to-end). >> >> I agree with Toke that allowing APs to steer specific DSCP use by applic= ations seems taking an proven non-working idea to the extreme... (APs can a= lready instruct stations on which DSCPs to map to which AC (see Felix's pat= ch), which is not used that much, no idea why anybody thinks that allowing = APs even more disruptive changes to end-point behavior is going to work any= better). >> >> Regards >> Sebastian >> >> P.S.: IMHO the biggest change might be the up-prioritisation of EF from = AC_VI to AC_VO, and I am not sure that is a good idea. >> >> >> >> > On Jan 5, 2022, at 13:02, Toke H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen via Make-wi= fi-fast wrote: >> > >> > Jon Pike writes: >> > >> >> Heh... So each and everyone in the stadium can have ALL their data >> >> prioritized above everybody else's! For a more Egalitarian world! >> >> >> >> Sigh... Meanwhile, back in reality... >> >> >> >> An aside, is that commit in git a significant improvement on the mapp= ings, >> >> or just some minor tweaks? >> > >> > I *think* they are just minor tweaks, but I don't actually recall the >> > exact mapping that's the kernel default... >> > >> > -Toke >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Make-wifi-fast mailing list >> > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net >> > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Make-wifi-fast mailing list >> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > > _______________________________________________ > Make-wifi-fast mailing list > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast -- I tried to build a better future, a few times: https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC