From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ej1-x633.google.com (mail-ej1-x633.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::633]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AC9C73B29D for ; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 19:12:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-ej1-x633.google.com with SMTP id nb6so6386257ejc.10 for ; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 16:12:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=broadcom.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=aeECtO4jo+wlsja2+AD+9urpP4gdO1SwbdawxaC4KgM=; b=hZpAFQItSXqyhRfNRbfYlDmuHqr0x6XmE56Qh/o2uY/A7purw0m+LeNtL2JSvD2RdL Jb1+EHQnuzTir97Y/awtDDrK7YcV9nc+o7ih9zUGp0vsDyckI3JXVcTpdMKsILiVhjFE wUfTOERDOQT07wWSRbCS4dtJl+oQl07AW3JIE= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=aeECtO4jo+wlsja2+AD+9urpP4gdO1SwbdawxaC4KgM=; b=sYVWi+k2rBO0UWCIbj9FYgEnq1EGEWS718jis5C2qeXsjQfLyUIzWaUGYSweb8AHvq D0xR1CjbDd4itw3gXDaEf2uBIyyx9G+IA9mEIslugltMiV6+dElLv/A6UKJcKNtKguDS 1PePrhem35APT8leDFXlv7u5kdZuqEVioPT69yZ2/2LbhPPSApHbUQJP0aIU56A8fvnc qZIqDFE16qkslautbRShLqIpJUx+kmvBnExBP12Jo0g9Xaw3S9tkOH2tMaH482Z/Gviy +a/MkUYz/0OJB6ma77b73D5MpKMIkriZoOxVehA/Txwwi1r5lo6XN4SaE2jFZ+dXT61c jd6w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5310lZU0vJISJs8FcSGWNM8cTTjJ55bLWdQaCkwLZz1VrlxiJ/wf 1Gpx2bHUUZ0kg7B2vTq1CyZ2PVW2lhZtKzNr9MQTgHV7mujgmZeMm8FInZCW/o0qejUZjbkJeLV kroNNlz1sMFw1L4mjsW9QZW6ClsNvXcY6ubqfQzBrRg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJypyi8RezbuNmbxgHyX9EhvbjpoZKP4KYveVHdajib9z2OvluxIurEJJ02cP6Wvk7abvOsEg7iRvmuGI5lvuYU= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:a281:: with SMTP id i1mr1814788ejz.307.1623885139468; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 16:12:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1d6d9778-bb9a-c3d7-1ed9-47aca13183e7@timhiggins.com> In-Reply-To: From: Bob McMahon Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 16:12:08 -0700 Message-ID: To: Dave Taht Cc: Tim Higgins , Make-Wifi-fast Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="000000000000eb3d7f05c4ea38f8" Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] linksys e8450 X-BeenThere: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 23:12:20 -0000 --000000000000eb3d7f05c4ea38f8 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e58f2305c4ea38e2" --000000000000e58f2305c4ea38e2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable How is round trips per minute a one way delay measurement? I'm confused by this. Bob On Wed, Jun 16, 2021 at 1:32 PM Dave Taht wrote: > On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 1:09 PM Bob McMahon via Make-wifi-fast > wrote: > > > > hmm, I think measuring bufferbloat and calling it latency seems like a > mistake. Sure, they're both units of delay, i.e. time, but they really ar= e > different engineering (and some physics) related phenomena. > > Apple has announced their new "RPM" metric, round trips per minute, > and incorporated it into osx and ios on the "responsiveness" option in > developer settings. > > > > > > Bob > > > > On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 12:13 PM Tim Higgins via Make-wifi-fast < > make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > >> > >> I'm not planning on testing that particular router. But my new > benchmark suite includes round-trip latency tests using ping simultaneous > with running TCP/IP traffic full blast. > >> > >> This Chart shows 5 GHz latency for all the Wi-Fi 6 routers tested so > far. > >> > https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/tools/charts/wifi-router/bar/247-mb_laten= cy_score_up_avg/44?see=3DP_B > >> The results are a "Score" instead of latency due to the way the Ranker > works. > >> Conversion to latency (ms) =3D 1/(score/1000). So the NETGEAR RAX80 > latency is ~ 6 ms. > >> > >> On 6/14/2021 2:24 PM, Jon Pike wrote: > >> > >> Any way to validate that? Or, is Tim already working on a test > article? ;-) > >> > >> On Sat, Jun 5, 2021, 9:00 AM < > make-wifi-fast-request@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > >>> > >>> Send Make-wifi-fast mailing list submissions to > >>> make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > >>> > >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > >>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > >>> make-wifi-fast-request@lists.bufferbloat.net > >>> > >>> You can reach the person managing the list at > >>> make-wifi-fast-owner@lists.bufferbloat.net > >>> > >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > >>> than "Re: Contents of Make-wifi-fast digest..." > >>> Today's Topics: > >>> > >>> 1. linksys e8450 (Dave Taht) > >>> 2. Re: linksys e8450 (Loganaden Velvindron) > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > >>> From: Dave Taht > >>> To: Make-Wifi-fast > >>> Cc: > >>> Bcc: > >>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2021 11:05:30 -0700 > >>> Subject: [Make-wifi-fast] linksys e8450 > >>> Felix tells me this ax router has all our stuff in it. > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Latest Podcast: > >>> > https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6791014284936785920/ > >>> > >>> Dave T=C3=A4ht CTO, TekLibre, LLC > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > >>> From: Loganaden Velvindron > >>> To: Dave Taht > >>> Cc: Make-Wifi-fast > >>> Bcc: > >>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2021 22:52:35 +0400 > >>> Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] linksys e8450 > >>> Is this because of the mt76 driver ? > >>> > >>> On Fri, Jun 4, 2021 at 10:05 PM Dave Taht wrote= : > >>> > > >>> > Felix tells me this ax router has all our stuff in it. > >>> > > >>> > -- > >>> > Latest Podcast: > >>> > > https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6791014284936785920/ > >>> > > >>> > Dave T=C3=A4ht CTO, TekLibre, LLC > >>> > _______________________________________________ > >>> > Make-wifi-fast mailing list > >>> > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > >>> > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Make-wifi-fast mailing list > >>> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > >>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Make-wifi-fast mailing list > >> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Make-wifi-fast mailing list > >> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > > > > > > This electronic communication and the information and any files > transmitted with it, or attached to it, are confidential and are intended > solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed an= d > may contain information that is confidential, legally privileged, protect= ed > by privacy laws, or otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. = If > you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for deliveri= ng > the e-mail to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any us= e, > copying, distributing, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of > this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you received this e-mail in error, > please return the e-mail to the sender, delete it from your computer, and > destroy any printed copy of > it._______________________________________________ > > Make-wifi-fast mailing list > > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > > > > -- > Latest Podcast: > https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6791014284936785920/ > > Dave T=C3=A4ht CTO, TekLibre, LLC > --=20 This electronic communication and the information and any files transmitted= =20 with it, or attached to it, are confidential and are intended solely for=20 the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain= =20 information that is confidential, legally privileged, protected by privacy= =20 laws, or otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. If you are=20 not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the=20 e-mail to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use,=20 copying, distributing, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of= =20 this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you received this e-mail in error,= =20 please return the e-mail to the sender, delete it from your computer, and= =20 destroy any printed copy of it. --000000000000e58f2305c4ea38e2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
How is round trips per minute a one way delay measurement?= I'm confused by this.

Bob=C2=A0

On Wed, Jun 16, 2021 at 1:32 PM = Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
On = Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 1:09 PM Bob McMahon via Make-wifi-fast
<
make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>
> hmm, I think measuring bufferbloat and calling it latency seems like a= mistake. Sure, they're both units of delay, i.e. time, but they really= are different engineering (and some physics) related phenomena.

Apple has announced their new "RPM" metric, round trips per minut= e,
and incorporated it into osx and ios on the "responsiveness" opti= on in
developer settings.


>
> Bob
>
> On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 12:13 PM Tim Higgins via Make-wifi-fast <mak= e-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>
>> I'm not planning on testing that particular router. But my new= benchmark suite includes round-trip latency tests using ping simultaneous = with running TCP/IP traffic full blast.
>>
>> This Chart shows 5 GHz latency for all the Wi-Fi 6 routers tested = so far.
>> https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/tools/charts/wifi-router/bar/24= 7-mb_latency_score_up_avg/44?see=3DP_B
>> The results are a "Score" instead of latency due to the = way the Ranker works.
>> Conversion to latency (ms) =3D 1/(score/1000). So the NETGEAR RAX8= 0 latency is ~ 6 ms.
>>
>> On 6/14/2021 2:24 PM, Jon Pike wrote:
>>
>> Any way to validate that?=C2=A0 Or,=C2=A0 is Tim already working o= n a test article?=C2=A0 ;-)
>>
>> On Sat, Jun 5, 2021, 9:00 AM <make-wifi-fast-request@lis= ts.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Send Make-wifi-fast mailing list submissions to
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferblo= at.net
>>>
>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0h= ttps://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast
>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help&#= 39; to
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0make-wifi-fast-request= @lists.bufferbloat.net
>>>
>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0make-wifi-fast-owner@lis= ts.bufferbloat.net
>>>
>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more spe= cific
>>> than "Re: Contents of Make-wifi-fast digest..."
>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 1. linksys e8450 (Dave Taht)
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 2. Re: linksys e8450 (Loganaden Velvindron)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>> From: Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com>
>>> To: Make-Wifi-fast <make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net= >
>>> Cc:
>>> Bcc:
>>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2021 11:05:30 -0700
>>> Subject: [Make-wifi-fast] linksys e8450
>>> Felix tells me this ax router has all our stuff in it.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Latest Podcast:
>>> https://www.li= nkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6791014284936785920/
>>>
>>> Dave T=C3=A4ht CTO, TekLibre, LLC
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>> From: Loganaden Velvindron <loganaden@gmail.com>
>>> To: Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com>
>>> Cc: Make-Wifi-fast <make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net= >
>>> Bcc:
>>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2021 22:52:35 +0400
>>> Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] linksys e8450
>>> Is this because of the mt76 driver ?
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jun 4, 2021 at 10:05 PM Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:=
>>> >
>>> > Felix tells me this ax router has all our stuff in it. >>> >
>>> > --
>>> > Latest Podcast:
>>> > https://w= ww.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6791014284936785920/
>>> >
>>> > Dave T=C3=A4ht CTO, TekLibre, LLC
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > Make-wifi-fast mailing list
>>> > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> > https://lists.bufferbloat.net= /listinfo/make-wifi-fast
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Make-wifi-fast mailing list
>>> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/list= info/make-wifi-fast
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Make-wifi-fast mailing list
>> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo= /make-wifi-fast
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Make-wifi-fast mailing list
>> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo= /make-wifi-fast
>
>
> This electronic communication and the information and any files transm= itted with it, or attached to it, are confidential and are intended solely = for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may con= tain information that is confidential, legally privileged, protected by pri= vacy laws, or otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. If you a= re not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the = e-mail to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, cop= ying, distributing, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this= e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you received this e-mail in error, pleas= e return the e-mail to the sender, delete it from your computer, and destro= y any printed copy of it._______________________________________________ > Make-wifi-fast mailing list
> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/ma= ke-wifi-fast



--
Latest Podcast:
https://www.linkedin.com/fe= ed/update/urn:li:activity:6791014284936785920/

Dave T=C3=A4ht CTO, TekLibre, LLC

This ele= ctronic communication and the information and any files transmitted with it= , or attached to it, are confidential and are intended solely for the use o= f the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain informat= ion that is confidential, legally privileged, protected by privacy laws, or= otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. If you are not the in= tended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the e-mail to the= intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, copying, distrib= uting, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this e-mail is st= rictly prohibited. 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