From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-oi1-x22a.google.com (mail-oi1-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::22a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C3ACF3B29D for ; Sun, 16 Jan 2022 14:09:48 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-oi1-x22a.google.com with SMTP id t9so20452378oie.12 for ; Sun, 16 Jan 2022 11:09:48 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=fsfx1dEGkvK3TVNxBXNAqwD/upjipQCWQzoP8De/D1o=; b=iSHktT+5nZ3PojtwnzPiKAFCzfVld48EEJ1j/oprOUQNm8o8FkZpbetBQ0O3Hj8Jrf 0Y1e0ZkdRfMgf2Vgqpfgz0YWXEqicuR+rclNafBDUIdY4uZjEZtM4LVXPmculqI3bSzU 5+CLU4yCj3PlDb4l3XygMBZJghxmUiPPYnUqUSCrKB5heG99Ka26gzE6FeKIgYBcHqtS mUgAt37xZkQrjzGTjcIgwCO0W8Gzl5PgjS7Oki6wcdecBsnEyA6yTTChqVy0drj78ifi Z0xL/a4n9i/hz3zg4TosDFZgK4v2BdYug605F1JLvGthzLBCEUtEl7dF70tO3GKeXkGd fyXg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=fsfx1dEGkvK3TVNxBXNAqwD/upjipQCWQzoP8De/D1o=; b=Ywn5iHR78LU1St+0UMjyLrJO+UwjXFt45rdgsBKIJPuvdsdh55HxnsFtU4aAx+LqFF VutAtGWzKBCrcjFElIpcHUxFvrOOfh1ytb5YHZkBk9+EEe8BvmiUViAkZlrPSy9ef1V1 NDCKwV2TAoWD4GxgOMXNc6HiXjtV466pnP8a1AU59WfiL9wxyMcl8l8wj5Ka7axMqdWq glDRRPwbxvsisEZJVW7Or6V+3V4fMCr7ZdSQfFUTkfSJtFIM+goGtCn5g3oPSMATTyX+ 5zyHkU+jqVJzhAX11Lyh3k1JQH87hNYxM8DZcv4wYMAslS+nrTbbu9pl9RK6lfwbOUOt wmzA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530kymiJOYefQEytFR/2N3X6iia9Lfb4zsPN22uA7u06JYZmcWI7 qMKeJzjQbw0l2OElEegDfbeUp+6FARIFtPaRL2Rk60bh X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz1ZqfkKDOptSpUmJaERjK03Ok/AkzmoTVu85w1nCu+ja8XNkRWwsmHNJDjLZrTxz8szYrUbI0MU9jrwX7LyXc= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:1201:: with SMTP id a1mr20397182oil.153.1642360187945; Sun, 16 Jan 2022 11:09:47 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Jon Pike Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2022 11:09:36 -0800 Message-ID: To: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000098875b05d5b7c780" Subject: Re: [Make-wifi-fast] cancellation X-BeenThere: make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2022 19:09:48 -0000 --00000000000098875b05d5b7c780 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hmmm... interesting concept. Sounds like it could work but depends on, well, several things. I assume you have to do all your adjustments during preamble time or part thereof, as to not lose anything important. I'm only vaguely familiar with the timing there at the PHY level but that's a pretty short time (the 200us?) and you have to use less of it to leave enough time for the RX station to sync. You would have to figure out theres a competing station(s) and somehow determine its bearing from you (how, repeated virtual "radar scans" of the virtual antenna?) then calculate and set an antenna array configuration that throws a null on it/them. You can have an active adaptive antenna array to create nulls in various directions. But, it would be more expensive and complicated and large to do that well. To what level of resolution you need to throw deep enough and narrow enough to be useful nulls, and thereby how complex the active antenna array, I dont know. Nulls arent infinitely deep, maybe -15-30db or so? Tighter aiming and deeper nulls need more complex array. There could be stations at too close of a bearing for a null to cancel practically, you're just out of luck in those cases. Sounds like a good idea that could work, but I wonder abt practicality, and pricing. I've gone out on a limb pretty far here w my top of head guessing, but I'd think you probably wont see it in >$100 routers, soon. On Sun, Jan 16, 2022, 9:00 AM wrote: > Send Make-wifi-fast mailing list submissions to > make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > make-wifi-fast-request@lists.bufferbloat.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > make-wifi-fast-owner@lists.bufferbloat.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Make-wifi-fast digest..." > Today's Topics: > > 1. cancellation (Dave Taht) > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Dave Taht > To: Make-Wifi-fast > Cc: > Bcc: > Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2022 10:03:35 -0800 > Subject: [Make-wifi-fast] cancellation > this looks kind of neat, but rather oversimplified. is it real? > > https://www.taranawireless.com/blog-2 > > -- > I tried to build a better future, a few times: > https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org > > Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC > > _______________________________________________ > Make-wifi-fast mailing list > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fastloop[ --00000000000098875b05d5b7c780 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hmmm...=C2=A0 interestin= g concept.=C2=A0 Sounds like it could work but depends on,=C2=A0 well, seve= ral things.

I assume you= have to do all your adjustments during preamble time or part thereof, as t= o not lose anything important. I'm only vaguely familiar with the timin= g there at the PHY level but that's a pretty short time (the 200us?) an= d you have to use less of it to leave enough time for the RX station to syn= c.

You would have to fig= ure out theres a competing station(s) and somehow determine its bearing fro= m you (how, repeated virtual "radar scans" of the virtual antenna= ?) then calculate and set an antenna array configuration that throws a null= on it/them.

You can hav= e an active adaptive antenna array to create nulls in various directions.= =C2=A0 But, it would be more expensive and complicated and large to do that= well.=C2=A0 To what level of resolution you need to throw deep enough and = narrow enough to be useful nulls, and thereby how complex the active antenn= a array,=C2=A0 I dont know.=C2=A0 Nulls arent infinitely deep, maybe -15-30= db or so?=C2=A0 Tighter aiming and deeper nulls need more complex array. Th= ere could be stations at too close of a bearing for a null to cancel practi= cally,=C2=A0 you're just out of luck in those cases.

Sounds like a good idea that could work, b= ut I wonder abt practicality, and pricing. I've gone out on a limb pret= ty far here w my top of head guessing, but I'd think you probably wont = see it in >$100 routers, soon.

On Sun, Jan= 16, 2022, 9:00 AM <make-wifi-fast-request@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
Send Make-wifi-fast mailing list subm= issions to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbl= oat.net

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or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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Today's Topics:

=C2=A0 =C2=A01. cancellation (Dave Taht)



---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:=C2=A0Dave Taht= <dave.taht@gmail.com>
To:=C2=A0Make-Wifi-fast <make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Cc:=C2=A0
Bcc:= =C2=A0
Date:=C2=A0Sat, 15 Jan 2022 10:03:35 -0800
Subject:=C2=A0[Make= -wifi-fast] cancellation
this looks kind of neat, but rather oversimplif= ied. is it real?

https://www.taranawireless.com/blog-2

--
I tried to build a better future, a few times:
https://wayforward.archi= ve.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org

Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC

_______________________________________________
Make-wifi-fast mailing list
Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listin= fo/make-wifi-fastloop[
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