From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ed1-x52f.google.com (mail-ed1-x52f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::52f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ED1013B29D; Wed, 4 Oct 2023 16:04:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x52f.google.com with SMTP id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-533cbbd0153so313853a12.0; Wed, 04 Oct 2023 13:04:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1696449870; x=1697054670; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=/fRrhYamFB8kn2EV5sKfLnChuUP8eudoUEcTou2nu2c=; b=KCrp1mYZo6j02yfggGeM2nuy16fInWjbW4Y4jqvbrjm6WTZ9oB3HraC5z8K+xFBl8O 5GykkTQjeU5R/MCE8LwAnbXPavVrsVrz0qIAQ9a7zOZNA2W4fS+eKsC6oXNDkN0aihqq si/7yclndTO/QkjtPHHodRnHw3++OwRm9PFHoxmtCUCB+CJlXgh8usmS4dWJPgQIkjT9 2OyC86g2TsIigTdlm40LMy3y9ee5Jcga+Hb9NPCcMTMn8ZLouDD/pWzK6XxMRWWBDSUG iU4TPrL0C8zCELIMaUDZB9cLgm4ex4ygJ/AXe6GW9+5jF1BKvoMeap3KeSNY8o2FU7LV SQEQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1696449870; x=1697054670; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=/fRrhYamFB8kn2EV5sKfLnChuUP8eudoUEcTou2nu2c=; b=PrQHeGuTOTYdzYwjJdQXH0SApp0whyQtN4OI696+05bEtepNcnj7nLKCvrJFe4D9az kz3/BDeq3y7aK2NgDQY34wN/7pfEJyWHXYUv8RGaZgCO1L8JjymuLgDzvVvctpJdKmb1 BcQl9qtj0hWJL7iUC9DWne/fUV+4yaEPULMP4ENqRANe5Zk0C9NS74Vy1JI0Y8qPTJnu beUiPNvDQeW6S/1CP9C7NXFKmSxX4knW0HynrhOtNrnt3tZ0fSnkQUahNNgdVOOWbW6P UebfqX8KBslSodrpJsTasBkGs+XGRazl85Gk4q5wwVH+1vtaNSGaE1rqbSTCGGdvzRBv 9uPA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yzr4R6oqQVNFIMLI7o/oaHQ4/FveUjwBethJO6Lr1wn3hS644ay Z0ySSO6D+UeyAFXlEZnF0/Xh/3JVqIVKiLbPl4qus/A4Xhw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IElmOtbSuq0QxVacuU+wGLlZua66MWld0esdtJOlw+w4N/jJFD0B3x2N32QjdqfgC8k68e9viXrQQVOVLL7uwE= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:c414:0:b0:538:3cf4:e880 with SMTP id j20-20020aa7c414000000b005383cf4e880mr2909102edq.29.1696449870335; Wed, 04 Oct 2023 13:04:30 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20231003205640.3.f99276b66eff3df4@mg-d1.substack.com> In-Reply-To: From: "David Bray, PhD" Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2023 16:03:53 -0400 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?Q?Network_Neutrality_is_back=21_Let=C2=B4s_make_the_technical_asp?= =?UTF-8?Q?ects_heard_this_time=21?= Cc: David Lang , Dave Taht , bloat Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e694740606e98386" Subject: Re: [NNagain] A good question - do you know how a toilet works? X-BeenThere: nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: =?utf-8?q?Network_Neutrality_is_back!_Let=C2=B4s_make_the_technical_aspects_heard_this_time!?= List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2023 20:04:33 -0000 --000000000000e694740606e98386 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Indeed and well said Dave Taht. I particularly like this quote on the Structure of Scientific Revolutions that may apply here too: =E2=80=9CNewton's three laws of motion are less a product of novel experime= nts than of the attempt to reinterpret well-known observations in terms of motions and interactions of primary neutral corpuscles=E2=80=9D =E2=80=95 Thomas S. Kuhn, The Structure of Scientific Revolutions And lest we forget the humanness of our endeavor: =E2=80=9CMax Planck, surveying his own career in his Scientific Autobiograp= hy, sadly remarked that =E2=80=9Ca new scientific truth does not triumph by con= vincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die, and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it.=E2=80=9D =E2=80=95 Thomas S. Kuhn, The Structure of Scientific Revolutions On Wed, Oct 4, 2023 at 3:28=E2=80=AFPM Dave Taht via Nnagain < nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > Sometimes I liken this debate about the internet, to 1906-era > partisans arguing about the right cures for syphilis. One side, > intoning with great authority: "Tinctures of mercury, yes a good dose > of mercury, is just what you need... " and the other side, insisting > that "Leeches, leeches will help... all you need is a good > blood-letting... and everything will be fine..." > > While those few that had embraced germ theory and were pointing at > little squiggly things in microscopes as the root causes of so much > disease, were laughed at and ignored. > _______________________________________________ > Nnagain mailing list > Nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain > --000000000000e694740606e98386 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Indeed and well said Dave Taht. I particularly like t= his quote on the Structure of Scientific Revolutions that may apply here to= o:

=E2=80=9CNewton's three laws of motion are less a product of novel expe= riments=20 than of the attempt to reinterpret well-known observations in terms of=20 motions and interactions of primary neutral corpuscles=E2=80=9D
=E2=80=95 Thomas S. Kuhn, The Structure of Scientific Revolutions

And le= st we forget the humanness of our endeavor:

=E2=80=9CMax Planck, surveying his own career in his Scientific=20 Autobiography, sadly remarked that =E2=80=9Ca new scientific truth does not= =20 triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but=20 rather because its opponents eventually die, and a new generation grows=20 up that is familiar with it.=E2=80=9D
=E2=80=95 Thomas S. Kuhn, The Structure of Scientific Revolutions

On Wed, Oct 4, 2023 at 3:28=E2=80=AFPM Dave Taht via Nnagain <nnagain@list= s.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
Sometimes I liken this debate about the internet, to 1906-= era
partisans arguing about the right cures for syphilis. One side,
intoning with great authority: "Tinctures of mercury, yes a good dose<= br> of mercury, is just what you need... " and the other side, insisting that "Leeches, leeches will help... all you need is a=C2=A0 good
blood-letting... and everything will be fine..."

While those few that had embraced germ theory and were pointing at
little squiggly things in microscopes as the root causes of so much
disease, were laughed at and ignored.
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Nnagain mailing list
Nnagain@= lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain
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