From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-pj1-x102b.google.com (mail-pj1-x102b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::102b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 660723B2A4 for ; Mon, 6 Nov 2023 07:47:52 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-pj1-x102b.google.com with SMTP id 98e67ed59e1d1-28035cf6a30so3377372a91.3 for ; Mon, 06 Nov 2023 04:47:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1699274871; x=1699879671; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=content-transfer-encoding:to:subject:message-id:date:from :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=AYJN6svgnLmmmy9hVRvPUvbbg9VPajwsig7KGq2a8n0=; b=Nu01K+Wh6GLiq2LAuxnVJgiEuXrVbgjlyk+tNvCBiw0OiybdV6ZCGpBWYLGgRbmu4E AM9gMvbdffx0ViyP6wcifiZ98alj1z5gESLWvZlv+9FDqHfCf7vZKSjzzDWQYnxFwe8l 2n3iLYYKqlXO6L3es2YPETAkU4cCuJ52kJuuFG0ltYbDJd4eLoYOzY/CNXAbZ7cF9evk i3VyLJcAORLwwPOqXF8MEjMLJG7WYOwDI0Z+GVXVQVVDVGA9IMCKVopmdTfWKaC8J+7q uIuScSMgwy6iMiY8T/Thy1BmLFlvTML2PmgMpmdh47KhEtk0JzXWtEX1Fp64U8dJYFGZ ESQg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1699274871; x=1699879671; h=content-transfer-encoding:to:subject:message-id:date:from :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=AYJN6svgnLmmmy9hVRvPUvbbg9VPajwsig7KGq2a8n0=; b=wOtoUUfKaYCpht+Kxq3kB148PlrOrYfvjaSrfDvzfk9YB7OmO5ApOe6VJDT9saFw9q Zn5nqHsRnc4aH2SyemO7MzY7HPfxZIyhGJaU6JMmoilTIpsj+EaBpkaueZjSwzuLuVo5 UCtgmYfpt9VLlwQNQCOVTOdAS9ncuisGkoAcxxEwgQZslCfF+LpM5RnehK81er1FuDIS mad1XqbsnlFtFv2vz90sLTtfrd7ipJunYgaMPcfVWrz5pfe+1SS4yXKvFDwf5/GK98xQ w/MmCxQyyb5NtAOnA9uvIuL3tBWAWluR2fvUy6cRFSKmJvXZNJrBEEEo1WhgjL8f7Pyw YjGg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YypmwjooIChAZGcrsdFNc6o0cGyWWjzst/fg4JBnmrLTQ8/qIxs F5+HfSA7M9fXS8tB8LVDPQ7g7/Yksaz1OZTLKRfqrX/2ieY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGYigDjtFTTFSMd5v5b9vJiFTm7WlSclUpNxcnZ7H6aI+iasbc5hKHy/r89Subhcv0VFpj1J2zmAAx2motmGxI= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:1a8d:b0:274:616e:3fc4 with SMTP id ng13-20020a17090b1a8d00b00274616e3fc4mr22667064pjb.34.1699274870900; Mon, 06 Nov 2023 04:47:50 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Taht Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2023 07:47:37 -0500 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?Q?Network_Neutrality_is_back=21_Let=C2=B4s_make_the_technical_asp?= =?UTF-8?Q?ects_heard_this_time=21?= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: [NNagain] What is the difference between "broadband" and "Internet"? X-BeenThere: nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: =?utf-8?q?Network_Neutrality_is_back!_Let=C2=B4s_make_the_technical_aspects_heard_this_time!?= List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2023 12:47:52 -0000 I was at the netdev conference last week, and attempting to attend to some extent, remotely this week's IETF conference in prague. I have two long emails piled up, and 6+ responses to existing threads. I do look forward to more folk finding useful and accurate information (thank you all for posting your perspectives). Newcomers to the list (we had about a dozen people join and 3 exit) should please scan https://lists.bufferbloat.net/pipermail/nnagain/2023-October/thread.html for topics! Two things that went by my eyeballs this past week: https://www.lightreading.com/5g/the-telecom-industry-looks-rotten-to-the-co= re Given how much the definitions of NN were weakened in the first place with "reasonable this" or reasonable that, as discussed in the UK and germany threads above... I do not know what the real fight is about anymore. Stay tuned for "more lawyer v lawyer action!". https://www.nationalreview.com/2023/10/the-fccs-net-neutrality-plan-is-unju= stified-and-harmful/ One of the things on my list for this week is trying to understand what differences, if any, exist, in regulation, between "wired broadband" verse various forms of fixed wireless (5G's recent penetration into FWA notwithstanding, many better technologies exist and are far more widely deployed) , verses mobile wireless? To me, it's all "internet". Is there a fundamental legal difference between "broadband" and internet? Similarly "licensed vs unlicensed" spectrum has got a bit vague with the wifi 6e rules regarding reporting location and height and power. --=20 Oct 30: https://netdevconf.info/0x17/news/the-maestro-and-the-music-bof.htm= l Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos