From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ot1-x330.google.com (mail-ot1-x330.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::330]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A17853CB39 for ; Sun, 15 Oct 2023 08:20:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-ot1-x330.google.com with SMTP id 46e09a7af769-6c63588b554so2439048a34.0 for ; Sun, 15 Oct 2023 05:20:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1697372425; x=1697977225; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:reply-to:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=rwB1kGtXMiHzAHj5rlVEyiyXxVQaHjNsrGWTzIq+qy4=; b=Iw2K7Z1QCJnszSnOOhomIU+2jWCe3xf5TY/VDgB38QC/T8GXfj9E8dFZyN38UM/IcY ugp8XHtrmc0cTWu4S+KOfbXe/ZkN3URpt1+WueZ0zMyw5nzwQps46+CZo/qlTb/u8xZ4 1GSmEWZdWj2lA0sWeJWUSf5apXkDGx2FLvjTRFvw2GFvNsvWuRalgvB67AzkuC/L+oHd Rl4NmOR9E9IxZKJmcIxC2yoauTkNySvGDgOhTVtLl8HxE7giMSxazxzaY4UmiroKWUus J14JUt28KfRFqYIa35Viq4kMrI2meevLblzF4WRqF9Vm7zMMLpZ0RFYNuSZF2mr09H2H u0qA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1697372425; x=1697977225; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:reply-to:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=rwB1kGtXMiHzAHj5rlVEyiyXxVQaHjNsrGWTzIq+qy4=; b=jdBZgpWeBEoQ+b+kSTNEcDfa7zaST/5L+bJ//C2pisMt5D70MAG8cdo2Ps1CgIoSLd U7C0c1Rqv2mWzVGqGUCRKYP/X68v97PNvFu09Gbc2azKOUD4iNb4CkTeICBa4LD2bqNm ZKyEZaYA4FtuD7tFHfkue///+z+actZR8HZG7a3wJYHZ8dm5a5nWOHS32BeThj6/4O3u 2lPNStjYFjKHe1gXp1kNj4WvzfqvaU6i/lnzYKCU4xnTGCkRsnZ5c2IQCt5GiPtcYZmf SIc8rkXHyLQs/OEwfw+vYxr3XOD0ec0xwphspT5IupCukT7v59ENSrXFGJosRykkTUBg JELg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyM2evBlsvylmAbWmVf9z2xJUaCa+6oBYn2Jn8Rz3A+r/itiJC6 Rk+kYIxGm1IMD9rpQ590fS7pYLkEORAYjhm+6zCcPouphjlyAXJ7 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFy01W264tENq+Ea/Rti8cY9kWUdkCwc6Ut4kwwRSNDCP2vIMN/+fVOP6aZy+I5wBhanI2k7RXOmDqZG7M0wdk= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6870:888b:b0:1c8:bfd1:ecb8 with SMTP id m11-20020a056870888b00b001c8bfd1ecb8mr37570754oam.30.1697372424416; Sun, 15 Oct 2023 05:20:24 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <851ba854e9bec33e55bbc7f3afd9e798@rjmcmahon.com> <725892E7-A50E-4B13-BDF6-B5F6721E82F9@ieee.org> In-Reply-To: <725892E7-A50E-4B13-BDF6-B5F6721E82F9@ieee.org> Reply-To: thejoff@mail.com From: le berger des photons Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2023 14:20:13 +0200 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?Q?Network_Neutrality_is_back=21_Let=C2=B4s_make_the_technical_asp?= =?UTF-8?Q?ects_heard_this_time=21?= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000068b1f60607c050d2" Subject: Re: [NNagain] if you had a billion dollars X-BeenThere: nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: =?utf-8?q?Network_Neutrality_is_back!_Let=C2=B4s_make_the_technical_aspects_heard_this_time!?= List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2023 12:20:25 -0000 --00000000000068b1f60607c050d2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Gene, you seem to have missed the part where the psychopaths who run the society have made most scientists believe things which just ain't true. You talk about seeing gravity waves, and you probably refuse to imagine that gravity is an unlimited source of energy which we can exploit and send the psychopaths packing except that they've fooled most of the people who think of themselves as scientists so that they can control a miserable world rather than participate in a dream world. Do you think I'm mistaken? On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 6:43=E2=80=AFAM Eugene Y Chang via Nnagain < nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > > > > On Oct 14, 2023, at 4:35 PM, Dave Taht wrote: > > That is lovely. I too would like to find a place to logout for a long > while. > > > You missed my point. I didn=E2=80=99t mean to suggest a logout for anyone= . > > Being connected to reality and life is hard work. > Many people distrust science and engineering because they don=E2=80=99t a= ppreciate > how every sophisticated technology and abstract facts are connected to > observations from the human senses back when we studied natural philosoph= y. > This is the chain of observations spanning thousands of years and > generations. Eventually, that body of knowledge was called science. Every > technical fact we know can be traced back through this chain of human > observations. Along the way, we build tools to extend our senses. Now, we > can =E2=80=9Csee=E2=80=9D and measure electron positions and gravity wave= s. It is not magic > and belief. It is the chain of hard work by many people. > > Similarly, connecting our individual emotions and values to society, to > the world, and to the universe is hard work. It takes us beyond our anima= l > instincts. In Zen, this effort is the work to achieve enlightenment. > > Gene > > > > > > 172 thoughts left to come in! > > /me makes mental push for everyone to check their spam folders > (was this list coming in as spam?) > > On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 3:54=E2=80=AFPM Eugene Y Chang > wrote: > > > Build an institute to teach an appreciation of natural philosophy and Zen= . > (I need to think more about generalizing alternative development to > spiritual connections.) > Many people have lost (or lack) a connection to both approaches to realit= y. > > > Gene > ---------------------------------------------- > Eugene Chang > IEEE Senior Life Member > eugene.chang@ieee.org > m 781-799-0233 (in Honolulu) > > > > > On Oct 14, 2023, at 4:00 AM, Dave Taht via Nnagain < > nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > > Thank you! 173 people left to weigh in! > > On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 3:49=E2=80=AFAM Qian Li = wrote: > > > I would like to fund in three areas. > > Quantum computer design. It is the next revolution in the computing world= . > Building programmable network routers that are sufficiently quick to > handle network packets at line speeds. In the meantime, router functions > can be updated as easily and economically as software updates. This will > solve the problem of Internet ossification. The deployment of new Interne= t > technologies such as IPv6 will thus become easy. > Home robots design. This may include cleaning, cooking, and babysitting > robots. They can free housewives from day to day housework. As a result, > more women will be able to contribute to the advance of computer networks > > Qian > > ________________________________ > From: Nnagain on behalf of Dave > Taht via Nnagain > Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2023 11:15 AM > To: rjmcmahon > Cc: Dave Taht ; Network Neutrality is back! Let=C2= =B4s > make the technical aspects heard this time! > > Subject: Re: [NNagain] if you had a billion dollars > > thx for your thoughts! I have a fear that the other 175 other people > here that have not posted yet have all our emails are going directly > into their spam bin, so I wanted with this post to encourage people to > lean back, relax (smoke one if you got 'em! Put on some great record > on the stereo too), and propose spending an arbitrary billion $ on > something they think would be good for the computing and internet > world. > > It is otherwise such an inoptimistic world nowadays. I was delighted > to see the whole earth catalog back online: > https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3D37872774 > > On Thu, Oct 12, 2023 at 11:23=E2=80=AFPM rjmcmahon > wrote: > > > o) FiWi chips and FiWi concentrators > o) Train people in fields that give them long term careers, e.g. how to > construct & manage fiber & RF networks > o) Things to help with climate impacts, e.g. advertise the heck out of > heat pumps > o) Fund shelters and support systems for victims of domestic violence > o) Try to find a business model that pays journalists so we don't have > to rely on Jeff Bezos for our news > > I wouldn't: > o) Buy an island in Hawaii > o) Buy a house that's more than 2000 sq ft > o) Buy a boat > o) Have 11 kids with multiple women > o) Fund anti aging research > o) Try to build rockets to mars, unless the project hired minorities to > do so > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Dgoh2x_G0ct4 > > Bob > > in trying to initiate some out of the box thinking here... > > What would *you* do with a billion dollars? > > ... > > I wrote this in 2015. I would not change much: > > http://the-edge.taht.net/post/billion/ > > > > > -- > Oct 30: > https://netdevconf.info/0x17/news/the-maestro-and-the-music-bof.html > Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos > _______________________________________________ > Nnagain mailing list > Nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain > > > > > -- > Oct 30: > https://netdevconf.info/0x17/news/the-maestro-and-the-music-bof.html > Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos > _______________________________________________ > Nnagain mailing list > Nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain > > > > > -- > Oct 30: > https://netdevconf.info/0x17/news/the-maestro-and-the-music-bof.html > Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos > > > _______________________________________________ > Nnagain mailing list > Nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain > --00000000000068b1f60607c050d2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Gene,=C2=A0 you seem to have missed the part where the psy= chopaths who run the society have made most scientists believe things which= just ain't true.=C2=A0 You talk about seeing gravity waves, and you pr= obably refuse to imagine that gravity is an unlimited source of energy whic= h we can exploit and send the psychopaths packing except that they've f= ooled most of the people who think of themselves as scientists so that they= can control a miserable world rather than participate in a dream world.=C2= =A0 Do you think I'm mistaken?

=
On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 6:43=E2=80=AF= AM Eugene Y Chang via Nnagain <nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:



On Oct 14, 2023, at 4:35 PM, Dave T= aht <dave.taht@= gmail.com> wrote:

That is lovely. I too would lik= e to find a place to logout for a long while.
<= div>
You missed my point. I didn=E2=80=99t mean to suggest a = logout for anyone.

Being connected to reality and = life is hard work.
Many people distrust science and engineering b= ecause they don=E2=80=99t appreciate how every sophisticated technology and= abstract facts are connected to observations from the human senses back wh= en we studied natural philosophy. This is the chain of observations spannin= g thousands of years and generations. Eventually, that body of knowledge wa= s called science. Every technical fact we know can be traced back through t= his chain of human observations. Along the way, we build tools to extend ou= r senses. Now, we can =E2=80=9Csee=E2=80=9D and measure electron positions = and gravity waves. It is not magic and belief. It is the chain of hard work= by many people.

Similarly, connecting our individ= ual emotions and values to society, to the world, and to the universe is ha= rd work. It takes us beyond our animal instincts. In Zen, this effort is th= e work to achieve enlightenment.

Gene




172 thoughts left to come in!

/me makes mental push for every= one to check their spam folders
(was this list coming in as spam?)
On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 3:54=E2=80=AFPM Eugene Y Chang <eugene.chang@ieee.org> = wrote:

Build an institute to teach an appr= eciation of natural philosophy and Zen.
(I need to think more about gene= ralizing alternative development to spiritual connections.)
Many people = have lost (or lack) a connection to both approaches to reality.


= Gene
----------------------------------------------
Eugene Chang
I= EEE Senior Life Member
eugene.chang@ieee.org
m 781-799-0233 (in Honolulu)



On Oct 14, 2023, at 4:00 AM, Dave Taht via Nnagain <nnagain@lists.= bufferbloat.net> wrote:

Thank you! 173 people left to weigh i= n!

On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 3:49=E2=80=AFAM Qian Li <li_qian_pro@hotmail.com= > wrote:


I would like to fund in three areas.

Quantum = computer design. It is the next revolution in the computing world.
Build= ing programmable network routers that are sufficiently quick to handle netw= ork packets at line speeds. In the meantime, router functions can be update= d as easily and economically as software updates. This will solve the probl= em of Internet ossification. The deployment of new Internet technologies su= ch as IPv6 will thus become easy.
Home robots design. This may include c= leaning, cooking, and babysitting robots. They can free housewives from day= to day housework. As a result, more women will be able to contribute to th= e advance of computer networks

Qian

_________________________= _______
From: Nnagain <nnagain-bounces@lists.bufferbloat.net> = on behalf of Dave Taht via Nnagain <nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Sen= t: Saturday, October 14, 2023 11:15 AM
To: rjmcmahon <rjmcmahon@rjmcmahon.com&g= t;
Cc: Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com>; Network Neutrality is back! Let=C2=B4s m= ake the technical aspects heard this time! <nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net>= ;
Subject: Re: [NNagain] if you had a billion dollars

thx for you= r thoughts! I have a fear that the other 175 other people
here that have= not posted yet have all our emails are going directly
into their spam b= in, so I wanted with this post to encourage people to
lean back, relax (= smoke one if you got 'em! Put on some great record
on the stereo too= ), and propose spending an arbitrary billion $ on
something they think w= ould be good for the computing and internet
world.

It is otherwis= e such an inoptimistic world nowadays. I was delighted
to see the whole = earth catalog back online:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3D378= 72774

On Thu, Oct 12, 2023 at 11:23=E2=80=AFPM rjmcmahon <rjmcmahon@rjmcmah= on.com> wrote:


o) FiWi chips and FiWi concentrators
o)= Train people in fields that give them long term careers, e.g. how to
co= nstruct & manage fiber & RF networks
o) Things to help with clim= ate impacts, e.g. advertise the heck out of
heat pumps
o) Fund shelte= rs and support systems for victims of domestic violence
o) Try to find a= business model that pays journalists so we don't have
to rely on Je= ff Bezos for our news

I wouldn't:
o) Buy an island in Hawaii<= br>o) Buy a house that's more than 2000 sq ft
o) Buy a boat
o) Ha= ve 11 kids with multiple women
o) Fund anti aging research
o) Try to = build rockets to mars, unless the project hired minorities to
do so
<= br>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Dgoh2x_G0ct4

Bob

in = trying to initiate some out of the box thinking here...

What would *= you* do with a billion dollars?

...

I wrote this in 2015. I w= ould not change much:

http://the-edge.taht.net/post/billion/



--
Oct 30: https://netdevconf.info/0x1= 7/news/the-maestro-and-the-music-bof.html
Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQ= os
_______________________________________________
Nnagain mailing li= st
Nn= again@lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo= /nnagain




--
Oct 30: https= ://netdevconf.info/0x17/news/the-maestro-and-the-music-bof.html
Dave= T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos
_______________________________________________=
Nnagain mailing list
Nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bu= fferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain




--
O= ct 30: https://netdevconf.info/0x17/news/the-maestr= o-and-the-music-bof.html
Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos

_____________________________________________= __
Nnagain mailing list
Nnagain@= lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain
--00000000000068b1f60607c050d2--