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Mon, 19 Feb 2024 21:03:14 +0000 From: Christopher Hawker To: Dave Taht via Nnagain Thread-Topic: [NNagain] ip address exhaustion podcast Thread-Index: AQHaYzTAri26/jHGUE+R8Lzjn/4VsLERtwSAgABsor0= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2024 21:03:14 +0000 Message-ID: References: <5cba1bdb-4b27-5c3e-9dd6-7af4a1edc1d0@swm.pp.se> In-Reply-To: <5cba1bdb-4b27-5c3e-9dd6-7af4a1edc1d0@swm.pp.se> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: msip_labels: authentication-results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=thesysadmin.au; x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: SYBP282MB0538:EE_|MEYP282MB1589:EE_ x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 220a8b2d-2446-42a5-0050-08dc318e303a x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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 x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; 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boundary="_000_SYBP282MB0538D35B77DEAB4B92525FC9CC512SYBP282MB0538AUSP_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: thesysadmin.au X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SYBP282MB0538.AUSP282.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 220a8b2d-2446-42a5-0050-08dc318e303a X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 19 Feb 2024 21:03:14.3533 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 33b3b0bc-94e3-4da1-858a-1eafc528debc X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: RnkyPfR8y23tguKMLYbcX4ybwUyYbkoUrqb3zS0tqReZ50coNLwJzyXBLk8t4/qxGJjlBjEjavXuk5m/KVsOMQ== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MEYP282MB1589 Subject: Re: [NNagain] ip address exhaustion podcast X-BeenThere: nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: =?utf-8?q?Network_Neutrality_is_back!_Let=C2=B4s_make_the_technical_aspects_heard_this_time!?= List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2024 21:03:19 -0000 --_000_SYBP282MB0538D35B77DEAB4B92525FC9CC512SYBP282MB0538AUSP_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Not moving 240/4 into publicly-allocatable space just because a few select = organisations are squatting on and using it as RFC1918 space (even though i= t's marked as Future Use) completely goes against the bottom-up approach of= policy development. Big tech can't dictate what we do with IP space just t= o appease their shareholders. We all know Bezos got enough dollars (and IP addresses) in his pocket. He d= on't need any more. Regards, Christopher Hawker ________________________________ From: Nnagain on behalf of Mikael A= brahamsson via Nnagain Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2024 1:19 AM To: Dave Taht via Nnagain Cc: Mikael Abrahamsson Subject: Re: [NNagain] ip address exhaustion podcast On Mon, 19 Feb 2024, Dave Taht via Nnagain wrote: > renting the allocations they own to their customers. (The 240/4 "for > future use" problem is a relative distraction, honestly! but amazon's > use of it *all* does irk me, as I had intended that space be used for > all of humanity). Certainly by finally charging for their IPV4 The fact that it's now used internally in places, is yet another reason it will never show up in the global routing table. Turning 240/4 into something usable on the wider Internet is a futile fight. It's however good for internal use as IPv4 already often needs translation boxes to talk to the global Internet (DFZ). So the work already done on making end systems able to use 240/4 is fine, but it also meant it's now used for internal things. So the fight should be to make it into proper RFC1918 style addresses for internal use so everybody agrees what's going on. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se _______________________________________________ Nnagain mailing list Nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain --_000_SYBP282MB0538D35B77DEAB4B92525FC9CC512SYBP282MB0538AUSP_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Not moving 240/4 into publicly-allocatable space just b= ecause a few select organisations are squatting on and using it as RFC1918 space (even though it's marked as Fut= ure Use) completely goes against the bottom-up approach of policy developme= nt. Big tech can't dictate what we do with IP space just to appease their s= hareholders.

We all kno= w Bezos got enough dollars (and IP addresses) in his pocket. He don't need = any more.

Regards,
Christophe= r Hawker
From: Nnagain <nnagain-b= ounces@lists.bufferbloat.net> on behalf of Mikael Abrahamsson via Nnagai= n <nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2024 1:19 AM
To: Dave Taht via Nnagain <nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Cc: Mikael Abrahamsson <swmike@swm.pp.se>
Subject: Re: [NNagain] ip address exhaustion podcast
 
On Mon, 19 Feb 2024, Dave Taht via Nnagain wrote:<= br>
> renting the allocations they own to their customers. (The 240/4 "= for
> future use" problem is a relative distraction, honestly! but amaz= on's
> use of it *all* does irk me, as I had intended that space be used for<= br> > all of humanity). Certainly by finally charging for their IPV4

The fact that it's now used internally in places, is yet another reason it =
will never show up in the global routing table.

Turning 240/4 into something usable on the wider Internet is a futile
fight. It's however good for internal use as IPv4 already often needs
translation boxes to talk to the global Internet (DFZ). So the work
already done on making end systems able to use 240/4 is fine, but it also <= br> meant it's now used for internal things. So the fight should be to make it =
into proper RFC1918 style addresses for internal use so everybody agrees what's going on.

--
Mikael Abrahamsson    email: swmike@swm.pp.se
_______________________________________________
Nnagain mailing list
Nnagain@lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bu= fferbloat.net/listinfo/nnagain
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