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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 23/11/2016 11:31, Pedro Tumusok
      wrote:<br>
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cite="mid:CACQiMXaJCvLR0P_ZwB1rxYSrkZdc3_EbTBjHoK4cdDT=9ZiaLA@mail.gmail.com"
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          <div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Nov 23, 2016 at 12:59 PM,
            Kelvin Edmison <span dir="ltr"><<a
                moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:kelvin@edmison.net"
                target="_blank">kelvin@edmison.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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                    Sent from my iPhone</div>
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                    <div class="gmail-h5">On Nov 23, 2016, at 3:28 AM,
                      Mikael Abrahamsson <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:swmike@swm.pp.se" target="_blank">swmike@swm.pp.se</a>>
                      wrote:<br>
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                  <div class="gmail-h5">
                    <blockquote type="cite">
                      <div><span>On Tue, 22 Nov 2016, Dave Taht wrote:</span><br>
                        <span></span><br>
                        <blockquote type="cite"><span>I would like to
                            see the industries most affected by
                            bufferbloat - voip/videoconferencing/gaming,<wbr>web
                            gain a good recognition of the problem, how
                            to fix it, and who to talk to about it
                            (router makers and ISPs)</span><br>
                        </blockquote>
                        <span></span><br>
                        <span>It would be great if the realtime
                          communications people (gaming, video, audio
                          etc) had some kind of help page where people
                          could be pointed to understand the problem.</span><br>
                        <span></span><br>
                        <span>I saw a Youtube video btw, where they had
                          problems with gaming because "I'm uploading a
                          youtube video at the same time as I am gaming,
                          stupid me". People don't even realise this is
                          not the way it has to be.</span><br>
                        <span></span><br>
                        <span>My take on this is that the problem is
                          fairly well understood in "our" circles, but
                          the wider audience still doesn't know, and
                          even if they know, there is nowhere to go to
                          fix it.</span><br>
                        <span></span><br>
                        <span>If we can find a product that solves the
                          gaming community problem (they're one of the
                          people who have "ping" in their applications
                          and who immediately notices when it's bad), we
                          could perhaps approach someone prominent in
                          that gaming community and making a video on
                          how to solve the problem.</span><br>
                        <span></span><br>
                        <span>"Look here, I did <X> and now I can
                          game and upload a youtube video at the same
                          time without problems!!!!1111oneoneone"</span><br>
                        <span></span><br>
                        <span>-- </span><br>
                        <span>Mikael Abrahamsson    email: <a
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:swmike@swm.pp.se"
                            target="_blank">swmike@swm.pp.se</a></span><br>
                        <span>______________________________<wbr>_________________</span><br>
                        <span>Bloat mailing list</span><br>
                        <span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net"
                            target="_blank">Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net</a></span><br>
                        <span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat"
                            target="_blank">https://lists.bufferbloat.net/<wbr>listinfo/bloat</a></span><br>
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                <div>The gaming/youtube video is an excellent use case
                  on whim to build. Simple, compelling, and can easily
                  demonstrate the bufferbloat problem. </div>
                <div><br>
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                <div>One suggestion would be to talk to the people/web
                  sites that publish reviews of router and gaming
                  performance. </div>
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          <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
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          <div class="gmail_extra">
            <div>Who actually cares about or read router reviews? I am
              guessing a subset of the people that care about lag in FPS
              games.</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
          </div>
          <div>How about approaching the people that make the post
            popular games that are affected. </div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>Battlefield series is from Dice and they have a main
            office in Stockholm, Sweden. Given them a demo of a bloat
            free game and a bloated game and hopefully get them to go to
            the players through their channels on how to get a better
            game experience would most likely give a better result. The
            game developers have their own conferences where they share,
            so if somebody in a studio ended up doing a presentation at
            these ones, it would also get the word out and about.</div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>There are other games, but I am not a big FPS gamer, so I
            googled and this came up </div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.gamersdecide.com/pc-game-news/15-most-played-fps-games-2016-pc">http://www.gamersdecide.com/pc-game-news/15-most-played-fps-games-2016-pc</a><br>
          </div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>But we would need a couple of things</div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>1. Establishing contact with the different game
            development studios</div>
          <div>2. Somebody to go and do a demo, shake hands and talk
            with them. Video, I assume would be less effective.</div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>If this something we should try, I can help out with the
            first point, but the second one probably needs local
            bufferbloat evangelists.</div>
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    <br>
      IF we're heading on to gaming, perhaps attacking a huge vendor
    such as Valve's Steam. I have no idea how approachable they're of
    course.<br>
    <br>
      As for FPS gaming, I can tell you that the most prolific gamers
    will go to great lenghts to optimize their experience. They are far
    easier to convince to flash a router, modify windows drivers
    parameters, change broadband providers then the bigger audiance. As
    soon as others notice this "unfair" advantage they begin petitioning
    the game developers so that the "advantage" comes baked in rather
    than be a special recipe.<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CACQiMXaJCvLR0P_ZwB1rxYSrkZdc3_EbTBjHoK4cdDT=9ZiaLA@mail.gmail.com"
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          -- <br>
          <div class="gmail_signature">Best regards / Mvh<br>
            Jan Pedro Tumusok<br>
            <br>
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