It is indeed interesting.I gather that Gazans are used to unreliable power, so many have solar or generators. Of course, generators need fuel, which is in short supply.
Le 30/10/2023 à 06:56, Ulrich Speidel via Starlink a écrit :
>
> The main problem as it stands with Gaza would be to get Starlink
> equipment in for the international organisations to use. Coverage
> wouldn't be an issue, but power and bandwidth would be.
>
I agree with these points.
But it is more difficult than that.
Indeed, if they can get starlink receivers in the place, then there is
need of power to power it. Maybe it is not easy to find electricity.
The bandwidth problem - I dont know precisely what is it in this
context. Maybe it's that there would be too many wifi users on a
starlink DISHY.
It's that Starlink can only support so many Dishys per area on the ground. Handwaving explanation: Think of each satellite as having a number of slots on each frequency channel during which it can communicate with ONE Dishy on the ground that the satellite can see in that particular area. Once a Dishy takes that slot, no other Dishy in the area can, because that would cause interference. Now scale that by the number of Starlink satellites that can be seen from the area, and you have a fairly rough idea of how many slots there are available in total for that area. Dishys will on average grab multiple slots, though, with each slot worth a few Mb/s only. More Dishys therefore doesn't mean more capacity. Now we know that Starlink is running out of capacity as is in areas with medium population densities, such as the Ahr valley in Germany, which suffered a flash flood a couple of years ago that took out all terrestrial comms infrastructure:
If a place like this can overload Starlink with a population in
the low 10,000's, then a densely populated place like Gaza with
(like now) enhanced needs would be running out of capacity in no
time. The entire Gaza Strip is only about 3 Starlink cells in
size, and has over 2 million people in it. Most of whom have
family outside Gaza that they'd like to keep updated on a very
regular basis.
There are more problems: I think I heard Israel opposes this idea of
delivery of starlink in that place. The question is _how_ they'd like
to oppose. Is it verbal opposition, is it opposition of delivery of
starlink DISHYs to the aream or is it jamming, or is it something else.
For the latter two, there is legislation in place that would guide the
way in which they could oppose, but that legislation is fragile. For
example, is there frequency allocation authority in that area, I'm not sure.
How they would oppose is a good question - I'm sure the Russians would like to know, too.
Sure, you can try to keep Dishys out, but given that roaming
access has been available in the wider region for a while (cue
Turkey earthquake), I would be surprised if there weren't already
numerous Dishys in Gaza. Frequency allocation authority ... sounds
a bit like Israel having the authority to tell Hamas where to park
its cars. As Starlink isn't officially available in Israel yet and
it's a small market, the regulatory leverage of the Israeli
government against SpaceX is probably low.
Jamming isn't really all that easy (again, ask Russia): To jam
Starlink successfully in an area, you'd have to jam the satellites
(probably about a dozen most of the time, and changing all the
time) from the ground in the same area as the Dishys using them.
Starlink can in principle now be provisioned anywhere between 53 deg north and south, and I guess with a few interruptions in service pretty much anywhere else, too. Whether a Starlink satellite will provide service to a Dishy at location X below it is a decision made in software, probably aboard the satellite itself, and that can be controlled at will by SpaceX.
Another problem is the statement of intention of activating starlink
over the place. What does it mean in practice. I suppose it is not
that simple as turning a knob on. Because these numerous sats already
go above the area, and the area is very small. The borders cant be
respected very easily from that high. This kind of statement like
'activate starlink' over certain area was already made in the recent
past. And it is the same unclarity, because that area is a small area.
(there are other - more clear - statements like 'turn on iphone sat
emergency calls' over other areas in Europe. But these areas are much
larger (4 large countries in Europe). And they are accomodated by
legislation allowing frequency use. Whereas in the starlink 'activate
over area x at war' there is no frequency agreements.)
Simple. You set a password on the Dishy's WiFi router and give it to legit users only.
Another problem is that, in case of delivery of starlink DISHYs: _who_
uses starlink in that area at war. One might deliver starlink terminals
in the area at war only to designated persons (e.g. a responsible UN
person). But a skilled person might plug that starlink into an existing
cellular basestation for the benefit of all: all regular smartphones
might connect to the regular basestation which in turn might reach the
Internet via starlink. At that point, it's not clear how the
responsible UN person might allow only some legitimate' (humanitarian)
smartphones to connect to these regular base stations.
Alex
> It's a pretty dire situation. Palestinian friends of ours have had
> extended family killed, the wife's mother is currently visiting here
> and can't go back obviously - plus her apartment got flattened in her
> absence early on. Then our friend's teenage kids from his previous
> marriage got buried under rubble when their mother's place got
> flattened, and that was just up to last week. I really need to ask him
> what's happened since. They came here because they were sick of Hamas.
>
> On the ham radio side, I helped a bit with band watch for MARS
> (military affiliated amateur radio system) during the first Gulf War
> when the local US garrison (Old Ironsides) got sent from Germany to
> Saudi Arabia. A lot of them found out the hard way that if you have a
> bank account in Germany and you're on deployment, your significant
> other doesn't automatically get access to it like apparently they do
> in the US, and the army didn't exactly think that it was their
> problem, either. Got to listen to a lot of that. First world problems
> compared to Gaza, though.
>
> On 30/10/2023 5:32 pm, Joe Hamelin via Starlink wrote:
>> The US did shut down ham radio during WW2.
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 29, 2023 at 9:27 AM Dave Taht via Starlink
>> <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>
>> I think that the internet should stay up, connecting people to
>> people,
>> through all the conflicts we may ever have. The mails kept running -
>> although censored - all through world war two - the red cross,
>> allowed
>> by all sides, to keep it's relief missions running, the churches
>> (mostly) doing their job to console the weary...
>>
>> Many other orgs, like the ITU, and the IETF, are committed to the
>> continued free exchange of information, no matter what.
>>
>> https://www.itu.int/en/about/Pages/default.aspx
>>
>> I am happy to see a worldwide ISP committed to the same principles.
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 29, 2023 at 9:07 AM the keyboard of geoff goodfellow via
>> Starlink <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>> >
>> > ➔➔https://twitter.com/dburbach/status/1718638348812595660
>> >
>> > --
>> > Geoff.Goodfellow@iconia.com
>> > living as The Truth is True
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Oct 30:
>> https://netdevconf.info/0x17/news/the-maestro-and-the-music-bof.html
>> Dave Täht CSO, LibreQos
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
>>
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>>
> --
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> Dr. Ulrich Speidel
>
> School of Computer Science
>
> Room 303S.594 (City Campus)
>
> The University of Auckland
> u.speidel@auckland.ac.nz
> http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~ulrich/
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