From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail1.bemta34.messagelabs.com (mail1.bemta34.messagelabs.com [195.245.231.1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 96A163CB37 for ; Tue, 30 Aug 2022 19:45:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrHIsWRWlGSWpSXmKPExsXSsnPBZl2OhXz JBn0v+Sza+m6xWhyb1shosXbxFlYHZo/Hu5czevx4doLdY/vFM0wBzFGsmXlJ+RUJrBkHF31h KWhmq7g7+wJ7A+N7li5GTg4hgZ2MEiufpUPYyxklDi/RgLBPM0ocOFXYxcgFZDcwSsyctBasg UVAVWLzhvmMIDabgIHExJ//2EBsEQE5iflPL4HFmQVqJVrn3gezhQX0JG62Lwfq5eDgFTCX2N jBCTHzIpPE1D0djBBxQYm/O4QhWrUkbvx7yQQSZhaQllj+jwMkzClgLfFh0QHGCYz8sxAaZiF pmIXQsICReRWjdVJRZnpGSW5iZo6uoYGBrqGhqa6xsa6huaVeYpVuol5qqW55anGJrpFeYnmx XmpxsV5xZW5yTopeXmrJJkZgMKcUK27ewThx5U+9Q4ySHExKorwHLfiShfiS8lMqMxKLM+KLS nNSiw8xynBwKEnwRs0DygkWpaanVqRl5gAjCyYtwcGjJMKrugAozVtckJhbnJkOkTrFqCglzr sfpE8AJJFRmgfXBovmS4yyUsK8jAwMDEI8BalFuZklqPKvGMU5GJWEeUVApvBk5pXATX8FtJg JaPHDJdwgi0sSEVJSDUxVfVNO/Q9b8naz8syki2pSzjk5OdwVwZsZ4o/PuBp7447652hnu007 1km1blF+n2bv2yb1TFGS57dPeVjT3Jl50lvPXdKI2yQxb9+2qhnZB273hVy8wNvs+kzy87r0x 6bW335Ii9QIHPsZsPCarebP1EDh6PapE86Gp8q9tGn//W19iCfLiS6WrJsqa1cxqpkt3BrRL7 NTMcWBX/mzoJrI7ftOgRudfzf/eve1I1C6aN1Oi3z1dbbTH0vwtsvscyg+enjp75CvYREqC5K aL2nm9vM5/1jxo/Xaov3vhbdO6T7279/GhVmTROW5V34q3ihren2JdeWh74YBXTfXiNZlvgzV Xd+r4t+Qwrwme6ESS3FGoqEWc1FxIgBOYP1GYQMAAA== X-Env-Sender: brandon@rd.bbc.co.uk X-Msg-Ref: server-16.tower-541.messagelabs.com!1661903112!74278!1 X-Originating-IP: [132.185.160.179] X-SYMC-ESS-Client-Auth: outbound-route-from=pass X-StarScan-Received: X-StarScan-Version: 9.87.3; banners=-,-,- X-VirusChecked: Checked Received: (qmail 25921 invoked from network); 30 Aug 2022 23:45:12 -0000 Received: from mailout0.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk (HELO mailout0.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk) (132.185.160.179) by server-16.tower-541.messagelabs.com with ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 encrypted SMTP; 30 Aug 2022 23:45:12 -0000 Received: from gateb.lh.bbc.co.uk (gateb.kw.bbc.co.uk [132.185.132.11]) by mailout0.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 27UNjCNV021574; Wed, 31 Aug 2022 00:45:12 +0100 (BST) Received: from mailhub1.rd.bbc.co.uk ([172.29.120.129]) by gateb.lh.bbc.co.uk (8.15.1+Sun/8.13.6) with ESMTP id 27UNjBsg004700; Wed, 31 Aug 2022 00:45:11 +0100 (BST) Received: from sunf10.rd.bbc.co.uk ([132.185.128.110]:35418) by mailhub1.rd.bbc.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oTAut-0005c5-Og; Wed, 31 Aug 2022 00:45:11 +0100 Received: (from brandon@localhost) by sunf10.rd.bbc.co.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) id AAA03620; Wed, 31 Aug 2022 00:45:11 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2022 00:45:11 +0100 From: Brandon Butterworth To: David Lang Cc: Brandon Butterworth , "David P. Reed" , starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net Message-ID: <20220830234511.GA3584@sunf10.rd.bbc.co.uk> References: <1661878433.14064713@apps.rackspace.com> <6p5n9262-3745-pq31-5636-1rnon987o255@ynat.uz> <20220830220710.GA2653@sunf10.rd.bbc.co.uk> <356psp-6n4s-5677-2qs9-1r71r492no@ynat.uz> <20220830223712.GA2921@sunf10.rd.bbc.co.uk> <26299n7o-8son-4133-4sos-44r8rp8n8825@ynat.uz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <26299n7o-8son-4133-4sos-44r8rp8n8825@ynat.uz> Subject: Re: [Starlink] Starlink "beam spread" X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2022 23:45:14 -0000 On Tue Aug 30, 2022 at 04:07:36PM -0700, David Lang wrote: > people need to stop thinking that because fiber is available where you > live, everyone has access to it On the contrary, it's still not available where I am in London, and that location was even worse off (sub 1Mb/s DSL in 2017 when we started). The point of going agressively good was to shame the larger incumbents to do better. The altnet industry suceeded and now it's being rolled out in cities too though still a few years away here. At the time I could not have built this in a city so doing rural served two purposes - help those without, help get everyone done sometime the only way to progress things is by direct or indirect action. I recognise USA has other issues making it harder. brandon