[Starlink] Planetary Society podcast on SpaceX & EPA issues

[Starlink] Planetary Society podcast on SpaceX & EPA issues

[Darrell Budic]

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Some intersting coverage on the route SpaceX took with their Boca Chica site and environmental issues here:

https://www.planetary.org/planetary-radio/space-policy-edition-spacexs-starship-vs-the-environment-with-eric-roesch

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Re: [Starlink] Planetary Society podcast on SpaceX & EPA issues

[Darrell Budic]

The TLDR; is probably:

- site originally used a sort of short form Environmental Impact Statement to certify for occasional falcon 9 launches, not exploding starship testing
- updates have been made to allow for the testing, and this is where the recent lawsuits are centered
- crazy things have been floated for the site (LNG shipping terminal, 250MW power plant) that would have required new evals
- lots of this is probably traceable to Musk’s lack of local PR and just trying to crash forward and the recent train derailments in the news raising awareness
- SpaceX seems to be realizing this site may not be what they need and may to be looking at doing more at Kennedy Space Center in the future
- if the lawsuit against the EPA stays in Washington DC, it may be trouble for SpaceX, if it moves to Texas at the EPAs request, it’s more likely to mean little overall

But you miss a lot of somewhat interesting policy and background on the Environmental angle, which turns out to be more involved than I’d have thought from a distance. 

Also nice that the Planetary Society posts a full transcript if you’d rather read/skim than listen.

> On May 12, 2023, at 4:53 PM, Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> could you summarize?
> 
> On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 8:48 AM Darrell Budic via Starlink
> <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>> 
>> Some intersting coverage on the route SpaceX took with their Boca Chica site and environmental issues here:
>> 
>> https://www.planetary.org/planetary-radio/space-policy-edition-spacexs-starship-vs-the-environment-with-eric-roesch
>> _______________________________________________
>> Starlink mailing list
>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Podcast: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7058793910227111937/
> Dave Täht CSO, LibreQos

Re: [Starlink] Planetary Society podcast on SpaceX & EPA issues

[David Lang]

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a few minor points.

They have always intended to operate out of Kennedy Space Center, as well as 
other places, so it's hard to tell if they are pulling back from Texas or just 
moving forward on their long term plan.

Remember, they expect that it will be cheaper to launch a Starship than it is to 
launch an Electron (let along a Falcon 9)

The initial plan for Boca Chica included Falcon Heavys, not just the Falcon 9

David Lang

On Fri, 12 May 2023, Darrell Budic via Starlink wrote:

> Date: Fri, 12 May 2023 18:18:16 -0500
> From: Darrell Budic via Starlink <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>
> Reply-To: Darrell Budic <budic@onholyground.com>
> To: Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com>
> Cc: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> Subject: Re: [Starlink] Planetary Society podcast on SpaceX & EPA issues
> 
> The TLDR; is probably:
>
> - site originally used a sort of short form Environmental Impact Statement to certify for occasional falcon 9 launches, not exploding starship testing
> - updates have been made to allow for the testing, and this is where the recent lawsuits are centered
> - crazy things have been floated for the site (LNG shipping terminal, 250MW power plant) that would have required new evals
> - lots of this is probably traceable to Musk’s lack of local PR and just trying to crash forward and the recent train derailments in the news raising awareness
> - SpaceX seems to be realizing this site may not be what they need and may to be looking at doing more at Kennedy Space Center in the future
> - if the lawsuit against the EPA stays in Washington DC, it may be trouble for SpaceX, if it moves to Texas at the EPAs request, it’s more likely to mean little overall
>
> But you miss a lot of somewhat interesting policy and background on the Environmental angle, which turns out to be more involved than I’d have thought from a distance. 
>
> Also nice that the Planetary Society posts a full transcript if you’d rather read/skim than listen.
>
>> On May 12, 2023, at 4:53 PM, Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> could you summarize?
>> 
>> On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 8:48 AM Darrell Budic via Starlink
>> <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Some intersting coverage on the route SpaceX took with their Boca Chica site and environmental issues here:
>>> 
>>> https://www.planetary.org/planetary-radio/space-policy-edition-spacexs-starship-vs-the-environment-with-eric-roesch
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Starlink mailing list
>>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Podcast: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7058793910227111937/
>> Dave Täht CSO, LibreQos
>
> _______________________________________________
> Starlink mailing list
> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink

Re: [Starlink] Planetary Society podcast on SpaceX & EPA issues

[Dave Taht]

On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 4:18 PM Darrell Budic <budic@onholyground.com> wrote:
>
> The TLDR; is probably:

Thank you.

>
> - site originally used a sort of short form Environmental Impact Statement to certify for occasional falcon 9 launches, not exploding starship testing
> - updates have been made to allow for the testing, and this is where the recent lawsuits are centered
> - crazy things have been floated for the site (LNG shipping terminal, 250MW power plant) that would have required new evals

I do not think these things are crazy. This location has many
advantages, being both close by to an airport and a major commercial
harbor and shipyard
( https://www.portofbrownsville.com/ ), which is also a source of
competent labor and other manufacturing. There are few locations I can
think of as good as this for rocket development left in the USA.

The ecological damage even of a full load explosion on the ground is
trivial compared to the damage already done by development elsewhere.

It IS too close to cities, being about 6? miles from san padre and 3
from mexico, IMHO. A 40 second delay in the ATS system, coupled with a
full throttle and out of control rocket headed straight in those
directions would be bad. Aside from that water surrounds about half
the area.

> - lots of this is probably traceable to Musk’s lack of local PR and just trying to crash forward and the recent train derailments in the news raising awareness

In the bars I visited, and the hotel I stayed at, approval of spacex
was roughly 100%, with a sense of pride and accomplishment and
knowledge in the waiters and waitresses I engaged with. I realize that
is not a scientific sample.  There were no protestors on the beach,
no-one with signs out saying stop this thing, either. I do not think
there is much lack of local PR. Also tens of thousands of space
tourists feeding the local economy made for some of the best live
music I have encountered in decades. There was a level of energy and
enthusiasm in this booming town that I have not seen in America in a
long, long time.

> - SpaceX seems to be realizing this site may not be what they need and may to be looking at doing more at Kennedy Space Center in the future

Certainly kennedy is more conventional but even more cramped.

> - if the lawsuit against the EPA stays in Washington DC, it may be trouble for SpaceX, if it moves to Texas at the EPAs request, it’s more likely to mean little overall

I agree that texas puts a much higher priority on economic development
than some.

>
> But you miss a lot of somewhat interesting policy and background on the Environmental angle, which turns out to be more involved than I’d have thought from a distance.

I will listen, but I suffered through the "snail darter" days a lot
back in the day. Environmental damage in this location is easily
offset elsewhere.

>
> Also nice that the Planetary Society posts a full transcript if you’d rather read/skim than listen.
>
> > On May 12, 2023, at 4:53 PM, Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > could you summarize?
> >
> > On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 8:48 AM Darrell Budic via Starlink
> > <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> Some intersting coverage on the route SpaceX took with their Boca Chica site and environmental issues here:
> >>
> >> https://www.planetary.org/planetary-radio/space-policy-edition-spacexs-starship-vs-the-environment-with-eric-roesch
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Starlink mailing list
> >> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Podcast: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7058793910227111937/
> > Dave Täht CSO, LibreQos
>


-- 
Podcast: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7058793910227111937/
Dave Täht CSO, LibreQos

Re: [Starlink] Planetary Society podcast on SpaceX & EPA issues

[Frantisek Borsik]

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*THIS <3 …I continue down below.*

“In the bars I visited, and the hotel I stayed at, approval of spacex
was roughly 100%, with a sense of pride and accomplishment and
knowledge in the waiters and waitresses I engaged with. I realize that
is not a scientific sample.  There were no protestors on the beach,
no-one with signs out saying stop this thing, either. I do not think
there is much lack of local PR. Also tens of thousands of space
tourists feeding the local economy made for some of the best live
music I have encountered in decades. There was a level of energy and
enthusiasm in this booming town that I have not seen in America in a
long, long time.”


I was always bullish on Elon: from Tesla stock shorting, to not believing
in electric cars, standing against any form of crony capitalism - and he is
one of the prime examples of it worldwide, to still not believing in his
end game (X - “everything app”, ala WeChat in China, which is a disaster
for Freedom, coupled with end of cash and CBDC and Social Credit system) in
case of Twitter, although I really appreciate that his involvement in
Twitter helped Free Speech and Freedom in general and it shines a badly
needed light on the state of the social media and mainstream media in
general. Especially on their enslavement by governments worldwide, they
have become just a regime stenographer over time.


BUT —> through all the lovely enthusiasm here, from all of You, and from
Dave personally, as we have discussed SpaceX etc…I feel that need to come
over to the US and to witness at least one rocket 🚀 launch on my on!!!

As I told Dave already, I was hoping to visit Baikonur, Kazakhstan 🇰🇿,
but not gonna happen, most probably, for quite some time. I’ve been lucky
to visit Peenemunde, Germany 🇩🇪, that infamous V1 & V2 rocket site of
Nazi Germany from WWII and I cannot recommend to visit it enough, to anyone
interested in rockets, technology and WWII, too.

Some readings to the Peenemunde below and can’t wait to see You all at some
of the SpaceX rocket launches. Thanks to all for great information shared
here!

https://www.dark-tourism.com/index.php/germany/15-countries/individual-chapters/223-peenemuende

https://www.erih.net/i-want-to-go-there/site/the-peenemuende-historical-museum

https://www.v2rocket.com/start/chapters/peene/peenemuende.html

https://www.historyofinformation.com/detail.php?entryid=3989

https://www.uncubemagazine.com/blog/12603627

https://www.porta-polonica.de/en/atlas-of-remembrance-places/peenemunde-poles-and-hitlers-miracle-weapon-v2-rocket

http://ieg-ego.eu/en/threads/backgrounds/en/mediainfo/v2-rocket-gantry-at-peenemunde





On Sat, 13 May 2023 at 1:41 AM, Dave Taht via Starlink <
starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:

> On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 4:18 PM Darrell Budic <budic@onholyground.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > The TLDR; is probably:
>
> Thank you.
>
> >
> > - site originally used a sort of short form Environmental Impact
> Statement to certify for occasional falcon 9 launches, not exploding
> starship testing
> > - updates have been made to allow for the testing, and this is where the
> recent lawsuits are centered
> > - crazy things have been floated for the site (LNG shipping terminal,
> 250MW power plant) that would have required new evals
>
> I do not think these things are crazy. This location has many
> advantages, being both close by to an airport and a major commercial
> harbor and shipyard
> ( https://www.portofbrownsville.com/ ), which is also a source of
> competent labor and other manufacturing. There are few locations I can
> think of as good as this for rocket development left in the USA.
>
> The ecological damage even of a full load explosion on the ground is
> trivial compared to the damage already done by development elsewhere.
>
> It IS too close to cities, being about 6? miles from san padre and 3
> from mexico, IMHO. A 40 second delay in the ATS system, coupled with a
> full throttle and out of control rocket headed straight in those
> directions would be bad. Aside from that water surrounds about half
> the area.
>
> > - lots of this is probably traceable to Musk’s lack of local PR and just
> trying to crash forward and the recent train derailments in the news
> raising awareness
>
> In the bars I visited, and the hotel I stayed at, approval of spacex
> was roughly 100%, with a sense of pride and accomplishment and
> knowledge in the waiters and waitresses I engaged with. I realize that
> is not a scientific sample.  There were no protestors on the beach,
> no-one with signs out saying stop this thing, either. I do not think
> there is much lack of local PR. Also tens of thousands of space
> tourists feeding the local economy made for some of the best live
> music I have encountered in decades. There was a level of energy and
> enthusiasm in this booming town that I have not seen in America in a
> long, long time.
>
> > - SpaceX seems to be realizing this site may not be what they need and
> may to be looking at doing more at Kennedy Space Center in the future
>
> Certainly kennedy is more conventional but even more cramped.
>
> > - if the lawsuit against the EPA stays in Washington DC, it may be
> trouble for SpaceX, if it moves to Texas at the EPAs request, it’s more
> likely to mean little overall
>
> I agree that texas puts a much higher priority on economic development
> than some.
>
> >
> > But you miss a lot of somewhat interesting policy and background on the
> Environmental angle, which turns out to be more involved than I’d have
> thought from a distance.
>
> I will listen, but I suffered through the "snail darter" days a lot
> back in the day. Environmental damage in this location is easily
> offset elsewhere.
>
> >
> > Also nice that the Planetary Society posts a full transcript if you’d
> rather read/skim than listen.
> >
> > > On May 12, 2023, at 4:53 PM, Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > could you summarize?
> > >
> > > On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 8:48 AM Darrell Budic via Starlink
> > > <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Some intersting coverage on the route SpaceX took with their Boca
> Chica site and environmental issues here:
> > >>
> > >>
> https://www.planetary.org/planetary-radio/space-policy-edition-spacexs-starship-vs-the-environment-with-eric-roesch
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Starlink mailing list
> > >> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> > >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Podcast:
> https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7058793910227111937/
> > > Dave Täht CSO, LibreQos
> >
>
>
> --
> Podcast:
> https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7058793910227111937/
> Dave Täht CSO, LibreQos
> _______________________________________________
> Starlink mailing list
> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>
-- 
All the best,

Frank
Frantisek (Frank) Borsik

https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
Skype: casioa5302ca
frantisek.borsik@gmail.com

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