From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 209473CB37 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2023 11:37:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E8523898F for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2023 11:55:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id ydTP9VGj1MWY for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2023 11:55:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 140383898E for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2023 11:55:05 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sandelman.ca; s=mail; t=1682351705; bh=pHHCl4qeCqSFRpkhaBRWraAJMzgdyadGneAsdQmFF8k=; h=From:To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=nI4nlxdQPB8FfME/t9iKyva+r3xo7gbjp3fKyOocDHiG+A57EAff3cW9zjpxVRanX Y1RZSvbv46YbQ7npO+wPBy0NtDdgYWiqsU5vY0JCv92tYwqU8+E47TjVg7FKaEVEw/ pHgkCVDY1M9oIkJtfDTKNJSKT13Tmq6EPnoO65iwPdXgPwA2bydQQ2nvVlfZIxnU51 Yzei/jkWAtTn99b6xUlL3gY0lUH0KbQU2mpJ4hfXGZXYoZA4mQqnE+9rgqJYJreufo rTW2LnkYEWY1PlrYo+ryENdWrhXkon7odlZn6OaXlT3VpmH0AlYXxnc+G/NX/kfJPp DwjC5vYYQL9lg== Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93B76182 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2023 11:37:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Dave Taht via Starlink In-Reply-To: References: <26657.1682349381@localhost> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 27.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Subject: Re: [Starlink] some post Starship launch thoughts X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 15:37:20 -0000 Dave Taht wrote: > On Mon, Apr 24, 2023 at 8:16=E2=80=AFAM Michael Richardson via Starli= nk > wrote: >> >> Dave Taht via Starlink wrote: >> > Everyone wants a water deluge system and flame diverter, but I was >> > thinking perhaps liquid nitrogen, as a natural byproduct of LOX >> >> Yeah, but how do you put one on the moon or mars? >> Lower gravity helps, sure, ... > Well, the concrete did not shatter at 1/2 thrust... Can the rocket get off the pad at 1/2 thrust? If it could get 4-5m away, it probably could work. >> > Landing and then taking off from the moon or mars look rather >> > problematic at the moment! >> >> Do the rockets do the swoop and flip on mars and the moon? > SSTO in those cases. Presently. SS... To Orbit. I mean... landing. Does one flip when landing on the moon? >> This part I just don't understand. >> (But then, the entire mars mission is fraught with dozens of missing= things, >> starting with radiation shielding) > I was a very lonely asteroid exploration advocate at the launch, > futilely engaging with the "Mars Firsters" once again, as I have been > since the 80s. I am with you on this. Given some mcguffin drive that could get us to another star in some reasonable time, when we arrive, we'll still need to live in a space colony for a few dozen years before said planet can be made habitable. (Even if it was perfect, we still need to clear some land and grow some crops, and find/build local source of power...)