From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9951A3B29D for ; Fri, 7 Jun 2024 13:34:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86B253898B for ; Fri, 7 Jun 2024 13:34:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 6_-AZ7fGPedC for ; Fri, 7 Jun 2024 13:34:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BE7A38988 for ; Fri, 7 Jun 2024 13:34:36 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sandelman.ca; s=mail; t=1717781676; bh=w0PcL5E8oXn3shSipExK/ikaeQwnqqLYFGdmKFJDMhM=; h=From:To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=kBm2f+2/4pFNg2aFyErdnLmRuUWEgma01Nke2y3ApfWkrXCLhbs7LE5LnU9tUGUJO Yt1pO5g/ifFGAjo557G1uR1gP22OVAJvnA80I6KPiTh/h6S6WPtOOrspOR6qin2nKc 2TIImj1KxDKizdZV250Ay+mc0VRTn8U7OfV+4ragg1jRUw6GjLQHCp7EsniKdn+Rq4 fVsPZK38oOEoX7OahbfOoxUFkm/PnYUfM2wuCGy2PW5D6AfoeDeQAaEE8/7SYtjgkm aRDzv4Ty6ZRCLUafG5VuX0tGhR9YPsJ7uaDk7Sv3ySkEgNgsbxb7IPCiIU9j6RPV0O uCumZa8JeCbYA== Received: from obiwan.sandelman.ca (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id F185C328 for ; Fri, 7 Jun 2024 13:34:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: "starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net" In-Reply-To: <2F6A4FBA-AFBE-43D3-9F02-4E74A1B2983A@gmx.de> References: <64FC2A3B-D512-4270-9285-C5AD69BBE40E@gmx.de> <61FA5621-4E64-4CB3-81BA-04D568939E68@gmx.de> <2F6A4FBA-AFBE-43D3-9F02-4E74A1B2983A@gmx.de> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.8+dev; GNU Emacs 28.2 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Subject: Re: [Starlink] 300ms Telecommunication Latency and FTL Communication X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 07 Jun 2024 17:34:41 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Sebastian Moeller via Starlink wrote: > [SM] I fully agree, that is what I meant with unintended > collisions... and as long as we are in the regime with little talking > over each other I expect little differences between the modalities. Back in 2002, the FreeS/WAN project moved from STU-III phones (I had two of them with a two-line conference phone, so we could have three locations connected) to H323 over IPsec [dog fooding]. Of course, each meeting started with 15-30 minutes to debugging: when IPsec didn't rekey right, we'd often wind up with unidirectional communications. (It was a very good way to debug dog food issues) A point that ||ugh made at the time was that he didn't think that we it was actually useful to be in radio mode: that all of the subsequent digital systems were designed to emulate the properties of the radio, which was that the *general* as allowed to shout lounder than everyone else until they all shut up and listened. The question was our conferencing systems couldn't just accept audio from each participant, put it in a queue, and play it out. Some participants might hear comments in different orders. I don't know if anyone has tried this. It seems that such a system would be useful for in a Earth/Luna conference where speed of light delays are 1-2s. Beyond that, one gets into sending video-grams as one sees in Expanse. -- ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh networks [ ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | IoT architect [ ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on rails [ --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQFFBAEBCgAvFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAmZjRKsRHG1jckBzYW5k ZWxtYW4uY2EACgkQgItw+93Q3WXYOggAilRA0WUHEupcwQoFsOBjooO0+qOBUuRP BGl2eKgp2Fku6KbywTKAUJCIEjeF57kx6SZV0976NZWdknS4IK8Jg7P5e+lWHtiW /MWg8r4/+Ai40di4yZ9BxgkToXaVEQdS3Z6/kfyONoj8LWCgLz0+KCMoEZk1Ywfu Fr3SN6vvJqXPtdyheRPJwZtVatiA/DS7lgIL8p1Kr3guL/jd1Y/NfCSdBn8Jyb+H 9WtiUaO4Q8rrD+iOX4o6+z2ph7O/3r7lD9K9HAWi43zpAAJGKQIip0lISNSb/yWr yfZZZuhVmnmSRMQRJh2oW3eYO8bZ8CorQX159nxW/91EzSeji1eYVA== =Bil1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--