Gene, David, Agreed that the technical problem is largely solved with cake & codel. Also that demos are good. How to do one for this problem> — Jim > The bandwidth mantra has been used for so long that a technical discussion cannot unseat the mantra. > Some technical parties use the mantra to sell more, faster, ineffective service. Gullible customers accept that they would be happy if they could afford even more speed. > > Shouldn’t we create a demo to show the solution? > To show is more effective than to debate. It is impossible to explain to some people. > Has anyone tried to create a demo (to unseat the bandwidth mantra)? > Is an effective demo too complicated to create? > I’d be glad to participate in defining a demo and publicity campaign. > > Gene > > >> On Apr 30, 2024, at 2:36 PM, David Lang > wrote: >> >> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024, Eugene Y Chang via Starlink wrote: >> >>> I am always surprised how complicated these discussions become. (Surprised mostly because I forgot the kind of issues this community care about.) The discussion doesn’t shed light on the following scenarios. >>> >>> While watching stream content, activating controls needed to switch content sometimes (often?) have long pauses. I attribute that to buffer bloat and high latency. >>> >>> With a happy household user watching streaming media, a second user could have terrible shopping experience with Amazon. The interactive response could be (is often) horrible. (Personally, I would be doing email and working on a shared doc. The Amazon analogy probably applies to more people.) >>> >>> How can we deliver graceful performance to both persons in a household? >>> Is seeking graceful performance too complicated to improve? >>> (I said “graceful” to allow technical flexibility.) >> >> it's largely a solved problem from a technical point of view. fq_codel and cake solve this. >> >> The solution is just not deployed widely, instead people argue that more bandwidth is needed instead.