From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from CAN01-YQB-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-yqbcan01on2132.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.116.132]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EE4CD3B29D for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2023 21:48:27 -0500 (EST) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=MCyUwMrvSjv2IGr4g5M6+EaDXD0yN2U/XE9wUd+6cp7prxBLAaME2JqYc4S+gfU/dUmLjI3NBI0FObD8Jhl126KGI3LwHD8sGznNbawNdVsiXtL4fD+xvbK40ptQMIDHqwbOw2LO4z631ByDZgr5gTunnFxqqRSL3vGdbSihkFGFv6AmIdICHBYv0g0b/4OO06QBJEwQlyzsNjKOZYbKUG3bGrScxgOvK+LybajCd8vO1vJ9m2/hSX2x1TuU57retJOCyWxhw0pVhymqbzu/ClnvnZvRpf3wZPy+IbkDDe1yW9Dn9RR67yXqE1b5d2woW7Po7nZXIqdoKS29Msnbqg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=1SCiAX6rblGPFUdzSceDc/Np2/Q+ZQCRSk/Zyr5SQs4=; b=m11o57cvezIKA01XOpjw7l88R02hrTnsh1v4ts4PYlIIIuelv6VQObGWVP96PoJh/oEZLGLSY3LM1H/C4luS+hvJZeyGOEEM0x4WS+hkEGBS8B8AEJrcXmYRQCw+0/1wVo3U1q1ZBNcFLGb1oWT3VQe9wptHlIR1pRJhbNNnFDi4H5lCODvFq27ZdkIBC9wkE1iTmrVnTt2Z83aERjDkxe/S4dNL3bGgHRbTUW6JUEgqrlBU21jhqsKucJrGAtkJGSfH0C5YF7wUe424F01VxvGDeULMGfdWra/EnPmtFgocjEVPocsAn03Ko1pBf1a+CC32Q26oIV9fAYMpO/riIA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=indexexchange.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=indexexchange.com; dkim=pass header.d=indexexchange.com; arc=none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=indexexchange.com; s=selector2; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=1SCiAX6rblGPFUdzSceDc/Np2/Q+ZQCRSk/Zyr5SQs4=; b=U+7tOntQv0FUkT08qMcS/L8pZqI8wPWKyH4+eit7qsYGRKPZ9kr4PmGUHrFHKQVqQ2c9wUIyH5fXtyJjgy87qVtv1aHudPAAjQQ8ktogU1+cQ1G9BJjvoaY+va+XPRnyFmzW5vQzfSa17mWsVNge5D87kYHY8nv4nnc0oVz90J0= Authentication-Results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=indexexchange.com; Received: from YQXPR01MB4756.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10b6:c01:1e::12) by YT1PR01MB8172.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10b6:b01:c3::21) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.5944.19; Thu, 5 Jan 2023 02:48:25 +0000 Received: from YQXPR01MB4756.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::42f4:f854:ca35:e413]) by YQXPR01MB4756.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::42f4:f854:ca35:e413%6]) with mapi id 15.20.5944.019; Thu, 5 Jan 2023 02:48:25 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------cL1Ue9tmqYUg4azyqZ2tQoNt" Message-ID: <82cfa31b-3694-7f6f-3f29-8de77559dd6f@indexexchange.com> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 21:48:24 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.2 Content-Language: en-US To: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net References: <845161E4-474C-44A9-92D4-1702748A3DA1@jonathanfoulkes.com> From: Dave Collier-Brown In-Reply-To: X-ClientProxiedBy: YT3PR01CA0070.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10b6:b01:84::18) To YQXPR01MB4756.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10b6:c01:1e::12) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: YQXPR01MB4756:EE_|YT1PR01MB8172:EE_ X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: c897252b-8d41-43df-e254-08daeec75100 X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-Relay: 0 X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0; X-Microsoft-Antispam-Message-Info: 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 X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:YQXPR01MB4756.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(13230022)(4636009)(396003)(376002)(136003)(366004)(39850400004)(346002)(451199015)(45080400002)(6512007)(53546011)(316002)(26005)(6916009)(8676002)(66899015)(186003)(478600001)(66946007)(2616005)(66556008)(66476007)(966005)(38100700002)(31686004)(6486002)(33964004)(6506007)(41300700001)(66574015)(8936002)(83380400001)(5660300002)(2906002)(30864003)(86362001)(166002)(36756003)(31696002)(43740500002)(45980500001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0: =?utf-8?B?eGNzaDJONVpISzJFWWkrYzJZMXJrdU5jSjcxcjJxUTBzVVRRNjdjVVRyendy?= =?utf-8?B?UEVGbkpIVnlONWRhWVg4aEJNK0JmWk01QmVieCtSYVVKb0ZsZ3c2djZuQitR?= =?utf-8?B?aklHVDVSeDNoSDl1ZTNnUkN0UUZIQ0dXY2ljUVRIQWVFOVF6V0hGR0Qzaktl?= =?utf-8?B?d2djMXZNMjhSOVhkTTU1eHhJRVFzNGR0UFQxWnNYUndyd2VML2RTclNYb0Nn?= =?utf-8?B?VU1DejlMM0NadmpHZCtna2x2enE3YVB0ZGFBMlI1VmtnMGlPMGFLRG9FazFn?= =?utf-8?B?bFJHYUdrT3FWYkpmandlcHVZMHhreXp6Wmxra2NhQnNvdHZ1ME1YTkVzTzZS?= =?utf-8?B?bEpSMkFia1ZLS2dTYVZYVmpmU290REFVR2M0VDRUWTZrRkNpV2hxR3V6TVZK?= =?utf-8?B?NjlLWTVvU2dXcWFSUTdMVUFhenlqRmtHQk8rME5KVm5McXRpQmFZeEV6MFBW?= =?utf-8?B?SGdja1llVTNVT2laZkxqQlhmQnpOSFNSQ0hqRW5jcnhGdlZLRG53RWtOazQv?= =?utf-8?B?RUdVdlBiVUtnaTJ3UUMweEhnU0hyMHBVOGUxVUJXdzdpdS9jTTQyVlJ6Tmpr?= =?utf-8?B?cVd5azZ5UE9rUHRYa2F6cUlaanpMSlFjbFZQUno1V1NIZms1Zzl5Y2FINlJ0?= =?utf-8?B?QkY5NW9wMHVoTHVjRktvUE0yNzNyOXY3STBsL3h4S1ZjSXJZV3QwTHdmRG9n?= =?utf-8?B?MHlySHJmVFdtSC9KM01UM2dzUlhHQWxWcmpTM0hpSDZJWVNuWEZFMVVvMUJw?= =?utf-8?B?b3NRcm9ZR2V6RGVyREVWeEJVU0xacjU5RnNUeVVkVk45R2NmVGYxRHhiTk1j?= =?utf-8?B?b0REUmlEd3JSZy9nam56bTF1by9KekJTbkFtcHBMdko1dG96WDR2bG1sUFdi?= =?utf-8?B?SjQ0QTl2aXdxWlhXVUd3SVNtUUZwa1p4LzhrZk1JVkM1WUtzT0E3clNEVzNW?= =?utf-8?B?dzc0b3hHNWJFUGxPUlR6RXlIcllsSjlmUStqMnFGUXdya1NEOW5uNms3aGFj?= =?utf-8?B?WDRWQUdnMTN3eHV0YU5ldXVxSDlCTXVVSG1ZbzZkS0tVZStGV3RXdHY5d0g4?= =?utf-8?B?ZEh0cHZEYmIrSUY2R0dmQmdNNFFTUHpTZDN3TFJBNENmWTJOK20xelNuOVVu?= =?utf-8?B?UUxMUDB4SlVDbTU4MHpwUmFoNWw2UXYzK3IvekV3bGw4dXNyTG4wOVkxdm9N?= =?utf-8?B?aS9qNkl2NU5nd25xZjA2UFRGYjZhdVArQ2VQTFJhS0dkMkxaNFFmWXM4V3ZO?= =?utf-8?B?NEFyNnk5OU1QYVRyVDA3THN1Ri9NVkZCMy93aktaTWw1aGZvdmtQbFcxOVR0?= =?utf-8?B?QUVlZ0RabEpud3FTM1pidHJOanM5WjNWakhCaVRBeEdielI3bmdIQWVieW9r?= =?utf-8?B?dEFoS3BUNmZleERnaHBDaFBCc00xT1pHdk0wWUZOZTQ1TGJTOFFMUTFDZkw5?= =?utf-8?B?QXNSYnR5WmVicjQ2RCt4SS90WG4vN2UzVmtPTkNoMTZSWmxsdkduQjNhclFt?= =?utf-8?B?d1pRUzF0VkdMSXZ6cWVrdm4vV1BGVHdyYUFSWHF1MGVkcFBOOXA4UWg4WWZY?= =?utf-8?B?Mkozb2VEZmVBbmVPZ3hkRzNHV1JXT0xPeFI4RlVoN1RjUHp2M0tLMzFLYUlO?= =?utf-8?B?elY2V3E0K2dOeFhCbXkvMm55RTNLcVB5elJYSXhCakV0SGdHbHIyeGRhT3pD?= =?utf-8?B?OVBiQXlXUGFpYmlWVVU4bTczblUxMTlOeWQrOHFwcGNYMnBITnVoODBvYXcz?= =?utf-8?B?RENtS2dzM2Q1MVdZekg2TnR4T1JOM0k1b3NSQy9tc0pyZGpPb01iY0JxdU84?= =?utf-8?B?MEdPaktkWTRDVTFrQitGVGV1WHZrQTFKUVhuUjdmZWZ2NWQ2YUNPcnZjV3Q5?= =?utf-8?B?QlBCSUVNMW1IU0xxdkJoSXVrWW5wQWF2bWRnUWJ3OGUweTV3dkFZellHVSt0?= =?utf-8?B?VUNKSU9zVEdCQUROeERMM1pram81M2NuOUlSL1RDQ1J6bFJxK0ZnSjNtbGs3?= =?utf-8?B?bk1zbE03UjhqcXRlYWhMRmYySHAxQkZMbE4xZllVWXFEWVdHY3ltOG1Xbm5I?= =?utf-8?B?aE9HeDk3VFdKVGViVWd3TDFjWWJxamdFOWhZTTdNOFExaERQdFE5NXlieS9C?= =?utf-8?B?bGNRbUdUQXE1YThTYTVHZ0loV1BiV2pqRjVlcllRdFdzS09NNEFibnoyN3VG?= =?utf-8?Q?iLfT3qF4LWTb0RXEUpie/j/MhQpYgvIaBjBIHsq5HiVT?= X-OriginatorOrg: indexexchange.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: c897252b-8d41-43df-e254-08daeec75100 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: YQXPR01MB4756.CANPRD01.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Jan 2023 02:48:25.4385 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: b07c0690-22b8-4366-8d8d-7b845d088e18 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-MailboxType: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-UserPrincipalName: HSuWUwfv5b0e4skA2Fp0Vm9yY1lhgB5K+BS/RwqjKT7YfL7UiMcDBCg/ai6Oou2eFSyQMF9ofQ80qTHlRinlUbhySpfUgUE9n/4qYNqoNcm4HdY8698cLVSKMYqr9GKJ X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: YT1PR01MB8172 Subject: Re: [Starlink] [Rpm] the grinch meets cloudflare's christmas present X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2023 02:48:28 -0000 --------------cL1Ue9tmqYUg4azyqZ2tQoNt Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I think using "speed" for "the inverse of delay" is pretty normal English, = if technically erroneous when speaking nerd or physicist. Using it for volume? Arguably more like fraudulent... --dave On 1/4/23 18:54, Bruce Perens via Starlink wrote: On the other hand, we would like to be comprehensible to normal users, espe= cially when we want them to press their providers to deal with bufferbloat.= Differences like speed and rate would go right over their heads. On Wed, Jan 4, 2023 at 1:16 PM Ulrich Speidel via Starlink > wrote: The use of the term "speed" in communications used to be restricted to the = speed of light (or whatever propagation speed one happened to be dealing wi= th. Everything else was a "rate". Maybe I'm old-fashioned but I think talki= ng about "speed tests" muddies the waters rather a lot. -- **************************************************************** Dr. Ulrich Speidel Department of Computer Science Room 303S.594 Ph: (+64-9)-373-7599 ext. 85282 The University of Auckland u.speidel@auckland.ac.nz http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~ulrich/ **************************************************************** ________________________________ From: Starlink > on behalf of rjmcmahon via Starlink > Sent: Thursday, January 5, 2023 9:02 AM To: jf@jonathanfoulkes.com > Cc: Cake List >; IETF IPPM WG >; libreqos >; Dave Taht vi= a Starlink >; Rpm >;= bloat > Subject: Re: [Starlink] [Rpm] the grinch meets cloudflare's christmas prese= nt Curious to why people keep calling capacity tests speed tests? A semi at 55 mph isn't faster than a porsche at 141 mph because its load volume is larger. Bob > HNY Dave and all the rest, > > Great to see yet another capacity test add latency metrics to the > results. This one looks like a good start. > > Results from my Windstream DOCSIS 3.1 line (3.1 on download only, up > is 3.0) Gigabit down / 35Mbps up provisioning. Using an IQrouter Pro > (an i5 x86) with Cake set for 710/31 as this ISP can=E2=80=99t deliver > reliable low-latency unless you shave a good bit off the targets. My > local loop is pretty congested. > > Here=E2=80=99s the latest Cloudflare test: > > > > > And an Ookla test run just afterward: > > > > > They are definitely both in the ballpark and correspond to other tests > run from the router itself or my (wired) MacBook Pro. > > Cheers, > > Jonathan > > >> On Jan 4, 2023, at 12:26 PM, Dave Taht via Rpm >> > wrote: >> >> Please try the new, the shiny, the really wonderful test here: >> https://speed.cloudflare.com/ >> >> I would really appreciate some independent verification of >> measurements using this tool. In my brief experiments it appears - as >> all the commercial tools to date - to dramatically understate the >> bufferbloat, on my LTE, (and my starlink terminal is out being >> hacked^H^H^H^H^H^Hworked on, so I can't measure that) >> >> My test of their test reports 223ms 5G latency under load , where >> flent reports over 2seconds. See comparison attached. >> >> My guess is that this otherwise lovely new tool, like too many, >> doesn't run for long enough. Admittedly, most web objects (their >> target market) are small, and so long as they remain small and not >> heavily pipelined this test is a very good start... but I'm pretty >> sure cloudflare is used for bigger uploads and downloads than that. >> There's no way to change the test to run longer either. >> >> I'd love to get some results from other networks (compared as usual to >> flent), especially ones with cake on it. I'd love to know if they >> measured more minimum rtts that can be obtained with fq_codel or cake, >> correctly. >> >> Love Always, >> The Grinch >> >> -- >> This song goes out to all the folk that thought Stadia would work: >> https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dtaht_the-mushroom-song-activity-69813666= 65607352320-FXtz >> Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC >> ______________= _________________________________ >> Rpm mailing list >> Rpm@lists.bufferbloat.net >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/rpm > > > _______________________________________________ > Rpm mailing list > Rpm@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/rpm _______________________________________________ Starlink mailing list Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink _______________________________________________ Starlink mailing list Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink -- Bruce Perens K6BP _______________________________________________ Starlink mailing list Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink -- David Collier-Brown, | Always do right. This will gratify System Programmer and Author | some people and astonish the rest dave.collier-brown@indexexchange.com | -- Mark Twain CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE AND DISCLAIMER : This telecommunication, including a= ny and all attachments, contains confidential information intended only for= the person(s) to whom it is addressed. Any dissemination, distribution, co= pying or disclosure is strictly prohibited and is not a waiver of confident= iality. If you have received this telecommunication in error, please notify= the sender immediately by return electronic mail and delete the message fr= om your inbox and deleted items folders. This telecommunication does not co= nstitute an express or implied agreement to conduct transactions by electro= nic means, nor does it constitute a contract offer, a contract amendment or= an acceptance of a contract offer. Contract terms contained in this teleco= mmunication are subject to legal review and the completion of formal docume= ntation and are not binding until same is confirmed in writing and has been= signed by an authorized signatory. --------------cL1Ue9tmqYUg4azyqZ2tQoNt Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I think using "speed" for "the inverse of delay" is = pretty normal English, if technically erroneous when speaking nerd or physi= cist.

Using it for volume? Arguably more like fraudulent...

--dave

On 1/4/23 18:54, Bruce Perens via Starlink w= rote:
On the other hand, we would like to be comprehensible to n= ormal users, especially when we want them to press their providers to deal = with bufferbloat. Differences like speed and rate would go right over their= heads.

On Wed, Jan 4, 2023 at 1:16 PM Ulrich= Speidel via Starlink <starlink@lists.bu= fferbloat.net> wrote:
The use of the t= erm "speed" in communications used to be restricted to the speed = of light (or whatever propagation speed one happened to be dealing with. Everything else was a "rate". Maybe= I'm old-fashioned but I think talking about "speed tests" muddie= s the waters rather a lot.

-- 
**************************************************************** Dr. Ulrich Speidel

Department of Computer Science

Room 303S.594
Ph: (+64-9)-373-7599 ext. 85282

The University of Auckland
u.speidel@auckland.ac.nz
http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~ulrich/
****************************************************************
From: = Starlink <star= link-bounces@lists.bufferbloat.net> on behalf of rjmcmahon via Starlink <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 5, 2023 9:02 AM
To: jf@jonathanfoulkes.com <jf= @jonathanfoulkes.com>
Cc: Cake List <cake= @lists.bufferbloat.net>; IETF IPPM WG <ippm@ietf.org>; libreqos <libreqos@li= sts.bufferbloat.net>; Dave Taht via Starlink <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>; Rpm <rpm@lists.bufferbloat= .net>; bloat <bloa= t@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Subject: Re: [Starlink] [Rpm] the grinch meets cloudflare's christma= s present
 
Curious to why people keep calling capacity tests speed tests? A semi = at
55 mph isn't faster than a porsche at 141 mph because its load volume is larger.

Bob
> HNY Dave and all the rest,
>
> Great to see yet another capacity test add latency metrics to the
> results. This one looks like a good start.
>
> Results from my Windstream DOCSIS 3.1 line (3.1 on download only, up > is 3.0) Gigabit down / 35Mbps up provisioning. Using an IQrouter Pro > (an i5 x86) with Cake set for 710/31 as this ISP can=E2=80=99t deliver=
> reliable low-latency unless you shave a good bit off the targets. My > local loop is pretty congested.
>
> Here=E2=80=99s the latest Cloudflare test:
>
>
>
>
> And an Ookla test run just afterward:
>
>
>
>
> They are definitely both in the ballpark and correspond to other tests=
> run from the router itself or my (wired) MacBook Pro.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jonathan
>
>
>> On Jan 4, 2023, at 12:26 PM, Dave Taht via Rpm
>> <rpm@lists.bufferb= loat.net> wrote:
>>
>> Please try the new, the shiny, the really wonderful test here:
>> https://speed.cloudflare.com/
>>
>> I would really appreciate some independent verification of
>> measurements using this tool. In my brief experiments it appears -= as
>> all the commercial tools to date - to dramatically understate the<= br> >> bufferbloat, on my LTE, (and my starlink terminal is out being
>> hacked^H^H^H^H^H^Hworked on, so I can't measure that)
>>
>> My test of their test reports 223ms 5G latency under load , where<= br> >> flent reports over 2seconds. See comparison attached.
>>
>> My guess is that this otherwise lovely new tool, like too many, >> doesn't run for long enough. Admittedly, most web objects (their >> target market) are small, and so long as they remain small and not=
>> heavily pipelined this test is a very good start... but I'm pretty=
>> sure cloudflare is used for bigger uploads and downloads than that= .
>> There's no way to change the test to run longer either.
>>
>> I'd love to get some results from other networks (compared as usua= l to
>> flent), especially ones with cake on it. I'd love to know if they<= br> >> measured more minimum rtts that can be obtained with fq_codel or c= ake,
>> correctly.
>>
>> Love Always,
>> The Grinch
>>
>> --
>> This song goes out to all the folk that thought Stadia would work:=
>> https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dtaht_the-mushroom-song-activity-69813666656= 07352320-FXtz
>> Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
>> <image.png><tcp_nup-2023-01-04T090937.211620.LTE.flent.gz= >_______________________________________________
>> Rpm mailing list
>> Rpm@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/rpm
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rpm mailing list
> Rpm@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/rpm
_______________________________________________
Starlink mailing list
Starlink@lists.bufferbloa= t.net
https://lists.b= ufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
_______________________________________________
Starlink mailing list
Starlink@lists.bufferbloa= t.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink


--
Bruce Perens K6BP

____________________________________=
___________
Starlink mailing list
Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink

--=20
David Collier-Brown,         | Always do right. This will gratify
System Programmer and Author | some people and astonish the rest
dave.collier-brown@indexexchange.com |              -- =
Mark Twain

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE AND D= ISCLAIMER : T= his telecommunication, including any and all attachments, contains confiden= tial information intended only for the person(s) to whom it is addressed. Any dissemination, distribution, copying or discl= osure is strictly prohibited and is not a waiver of confidentiality. If you= have received this telecommunication in error, please notify the sender im= mediately by return electronic mail and delete the message from your inbox and deleted items folders. This tel= ecommunication does not constitute an express or implied agreement to condu= ct transactions by electronic means, nor does it constitute a contract offe= r, a contract amendment or an acceptance of a contract offer. Contract terms contained in this telecommunication ar= e subject to legal review and the completion of formal documentation and ar= e not binding until same is confirmed in writing and has been signed by an = authorized signatory.

--------------cL1Ue9tmqYUg4azyqZ2tQoNt--