[Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Dave Taht]

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I ordered my dishy today. It looks like a couple months or more before I can get one… :(

I have all sorts of cool stuff for rock steady movement compensation and so forth on my sailboat here. I hope, that at least at anchor in pillar point harbor or nearby, that it will “just work”.  It’s been a useful place to debug and improve LTE and 5G behaviors for the past couple years. 

When starlink gets movement truly mastered it will be *awesome*. 

My LTE up on the mast is pretty amazing (I get 5+ miles and pretty good behavior from the cake instance and monitoring tools there) but there are many spots along the california coast (and obviously further out) that are dead zones. 

The 100+W power requirements are going to hurt though! I just ordered another solar panel and some hefty lithium batteries. 

> Begin forwarded message:
> 
> From: "Starlink" <no-reply@starlink.com>
> Subject: Starlink Order Confirmed
> Date: June 24, 2021 at 5:44:17 PM PDT
> To: davet@teklibre.net
> 
> 
> Order Confirmed
> 
> 
> Order Number:
> ORD-972149-36038-99
> Service Address:
> 80 Cabrillo Hwy N, Half Moon Bay, CA 94019, USA
> Shipping Address:
> 80 CABRILLO HWY N STE Q, PMB 404, HALF MOON BAY, CA, 94019-1650, US
> 
> Starlink is targeting coverage in your area in mid to late 2021. Orders will be fulfilled on a first-come, first-served basis. You will be notified via email prior to shipment, and you will be charged the remainder of your balance 3 days after you receive your order notification email.
> 
> Your Starlink Kit will arrive with your Starlink, wifi router, power supply, cables and mounting tripod. For more information or to cancel your order, sign in to your account.
> SIGN IN TO MY ACCOUNT <https://auth.starlink.com/set-password?code=0e9b9715-febd-4078-a1d6-80b5090ca182>
> Space Exploration Technologies Corp | 1 Rocket Road, Hawthorne, CA 90250 
> Questions? See Starlink FAQs <https://www.starlink.com/faq>

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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Nathan Owens]

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*pre-ordered (so much confusion about this on Reddit)

The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw. Might pull more in snow
melt mode

—Nathan


On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 7:01 PM Dave Taht <davet@teklibre.net> wrote:

> I ordered my dishy today. It looks like a couple months or more before I
> can get one… :(
>
> I have all sorts of cool stuff for rock steady movement compensation and
> so forth on my sailboat here. I hope, that at least at anchor in pillar
> point harbor or nearby, that it will “just work”.  It’s been a useful place
> to debug and improve LTE and 5G behaviors for the past couple years.
>
> When starlink gets movement truly mastered it will be *awesome*.
>
> My LTE up on the mast is pretty amazing (I get 5+ miles and pretty good
> behavior from the cake instance and monitoring tools there) but there are
> many spots along the california coast (and obviously further out) that are
> dead zones.
>
> The 100+W power requirements are going to hurt though! I just ordered
> another solar panel and some hefty lithium batteries.
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
> *From: *"Starlink" <no-reply@starlink.com>
> *Subject: **Starlink Order Confirmed*
> *Date: *June 24, 2021 at 5:44:17 PM PDT
> *To: *davet@teklibre.net
>
> [image: Starlink Logo]
>
> Order Confirmed
> Order Number:
> *ORD-972149-36038-99*
> Service Address:
> *80 Cabrillo Hwy N, Half Moon Bay, CA 94019, USA
> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+Cabrillo+Hwy+N,+Half+Moon+Bay,+CA+94019,+USA?entry=gmail&source=g>*
> Shipping Address:
> *80 CABRILLO HWY N STE Q
> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+CABRILLO+HWY+N+STE+Q?entry=gmail&source=g>,
> PMB 404, HALF MOON BAY, CA, 94019-1650, US*
>
> Starlink is targeting coverage in your area in mid to late 2021. Orders
> will be fulfilled on a first-come, first-served basis. You will be notified
> via email prior to shipment, and you will be charged the remainder of your
> balance 3 days after you receive your order notification email.
>
> Your Starlink Kit will arrive with your Starlink, wifi router, power
> supply, cables and mounting tripod. For more information or to cancel your
> order, sign in to your account.
> SIGN IN TO MY ACCOUNT
> <https://auth.starlink.com/set-password?code=0e9b9715-febd-4078-a1d6-80b5090ca182>
>
> Space Exploration Technologies Corp | 1 Rocket Road, Hawthorne, CA 90250
> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/1+Rocket+Road,+Hawthorne,+CA+90250?entry=gmail&source=g>
>
> Questions? See Starlink FAQs <https://www.starlink.com/faq>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Starlink mailing list
> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>

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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Dave Taht]

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> On Jun 24, 2021, at 6:36 PM, Nathan Owens <nathan@nathan.io> wrote:
> 
> *pre-ordered (so much confusion about this on Reddit)
> 
> The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw.

One of the things we worked on in the make-wifi-fast project was combined power and rate control. 

My guess is that if all you want is 2Mbit service you can cut the power requirements enormously.

> Might pull more in snow melt mode

One of my unanswered questions is how long does it take to power up and start transferring data?

I’ve worked on linux fast boot (sub second boot times) - in the past. Most seem to have forgotten how to do that (sigh) and have boot times measured in minutes. One reason why I like openwrt so much is it boots in seconds - totally bound by the pathetically slow NAND or NOR chips other people insist on using still. With some work you can also get rid of the friggin bootloader, also.

My initial model for the marine market and for one of my clients is very different from how most use the internet today as an always on service.

In this case I just need to get on a couple times a day, download my email, grab a few new music files, get the weather report, and get off. So I really don’t need all that much power for very long, except to surf the web briefly and make a ton of videoconference calls. An hour or two a day, tops.

I’ve written a lot about “designing for the disconnect” in the past 4 decades and I really kind of hate the idea of the internet being an always-on drug. Here’s one old talk I gave in australia quite some time back about it.

http://the-edge.blogspot.com/2019/12/designing-for-disconnect.html


There’s another always-on marine sub-project we’re on, though, that I *long* to talk about but can’t, unless somehow we can get the starlink folk to do an apollo 13 and fix their !@#!! bufferbloat with something like cake, or we can figure out how to optimize dynamically for it via another router hanging off of the dishy. 

tidbit - one time recently I was 10 miles out at sea, in a 25 knot gale and 15+ seas trying to write something down important, and I hit the wrong key and the !@#!@@ new apple M1 laptop  asked me:

“do you want to install siri”

"No, damn it, I just want to write stuff. If there’s no friggin internet why on earth do I want to use siri?”

(apologies I’m grumpy today)

> 
> —Nathan
> 
> 
> On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 7:01 PM Dave Taht <davet@teklibre.net <mailto:davet@teklibre.net>> wrote:
> I ordered my dishy today. It looks like a couple months or more before I can get one… :(
> 
> I have all sorts of cool stuff for rock steady movement compensation and so forth on my sailboat here. I hope, that at least at anchor in pillar point harbor or nearby, that it will “just work”.  It’s been a useful place to debug and improve LTE and 5G behaviors for the past couple years. 
> 
> When starlink gets movement truly mastered it will be *awesome*. 
> 
> My LTE up on the mast is pretty amazing (I get 5+ miles and pretty good behavior from the cake instance and monitoring tools there) but there are many spots along the california coast (and obviously further out) that are dead zones. 
> 
> The 100+W power requirements are going to hurt though! I just ordered another solar panel and some hefty lithium batteries. 
> 
>> Begin forwarded message:
>> 
>> From: "Starlink" <no-reply@starlink.com <mailto:no-reply@starlink.com>>
>> Subject: Starlink Order Confirmed
>> Date: June 24, 2021 at 5:44:17 PM PDT
>> To: davet@teklibre.net <mailto:davet@teklibre.net>
>> 
>> 
>> Order Confirmed
>> 
>> 
>> Order Number:
>> ORD-972149-36038-99
>> Service Address:
>> 80 Cabrillo Hwy N, Half Moon Bay, CA 94019, USA <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+Cabrillo+Hwy+N,+Half+Moon+Bay,+CA+94019,+USA?entry=gmail&source=g>
>> Shipping Address:
>> 80 CABRILLO HWY N STE Q <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+CABRILLO+HWY+N+STE+Q?entry=gmail&source=g>, PMB 404, HALF MOON BAY, CA, 94019-1650, US
>> 
>> Starlink is targeting coverage in your area in mid to late 2021. Orders will be fulfilled on a first-come, first-served basis. You will be notified via email prior to shipment, and you will be charged the remainder of your balance 3 days after you receive your order notification email.
>> 
>> Your Starlink Kit will arrive with your Starlink, wifi router, power supply, cables and mounting tripod. For more information or to cancel your order, sign in to your account.
>> SIGN IN TO MY ACCOUNT <https://auth.starlink.com/set-password?code=0e9b9715-febd-4078-a1d6-80b5090ca182>
>> Space Exploration Technologies Corp | 1 Rocket Road, Hawthorne, CA 90250 <https://www.google.com/maps/search/1+Rocket+Road,+Hawthorne,+CA+90250?entry=gmail&source=g> 
>> Questions? See Starlink FAQs <https://www.starlink.com/faq>
> _______________________________________________
> Starlink mailing list
> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net <mailto:Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink <https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink>


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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Nathan Owens]

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That may have sounded more terse than I intended…  the starlink ordering
system is kinda confusing — there are several possible options I’ve seen:
- full order - your cell is open, you can pay them $600 and get a dish soon
(2-3wks?)
- pre-order - mid-late 2021 *coverage*, first come first served
- pre-order - at capacity - late 2022+, first come first served
- not available

They have over 500k pre orders, and given the chip shortage, I have my
doubts that all of those who ordered with *coverage* slated by EoY will all
receive hardware by then.

With that being said, I hope you get yours soon!

On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 7:36 PM Nathan Owens <nathan@nathan.io> wrote:

> *pre-ordered (so much confusion about this on Reddit)
>
> The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw. Might pull more in snow
> melt mode
>
> —Nathan
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 7:01 PM Dave Taht <davet@teklibre.net> wrote:
>
>> I ordered my dishy today. It looks like a couple months or more before I
>> can get one… :(
>>
>> I have all sorts of cool stuff for rock steady movement compensation and
>> so forth on my sailboat here. I hope, that at least at anchor in pillar
>> point harbor or nearby, that it will “just work”.  It’s been a useful place
>> to debug and improve LTE and 5G behaviors for the past couple years.
>>
>> When starlink gets movement truly mastered it will be *awesome*.
>>
>> My LTE up on the mast is pretty amazing (I get 5+ miles and pretty good
>> behavior from the cake instance and monitoring tools there) but there are
>> many spots along the california coast (and obviously further out) that are
>> dead zones.
>>
>> The 100+W power requirements are going to hurt though! I just ordered
>> another solar panel and some hefty lithium batteries.
>>
>> Begin forwarded message:
>>
>> *From: *"Starlink" <no-reply@starlink.com>
>> *Subject: **Starlink Order Confirmed*
>> *Date: *June 24, 2021 at 5:44:17 PM PDT
>> *To: *davet@teklibre.net
>>
>> [image: Starlink Logo]
>>
>> Order Confirmed
>> Order Number:
>> *ORD-972149-36038-99*
>> Service Address:
>> *80 Cabrillo Hwy N, Half Moon Bay, CA 94019, USA
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+Cabrillo+Hwy+N,+Half+Moon+Bay,+CA+94019,+USA?entry=gmail&source=g>*
>> Shipping Address:
>> *80 CABRILLO HWY N STE Q
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+CABRILLO+HWY+N+STE+Q?entry=gmail&source=g>,
>> PMB 404, HALF MOON BAY, CA, 94019-1650, US*
>>
>> Starlink is targeting coverage in your area in mid to late 2021. Orders
>> will be fulfilled on a first-come, first-served basis. You will be notified
>> via email prior to shipment, and you will be charged the remainder of your
>> balance 3 days after you receive your order notification email.
>>
>> Your Starlink Kit will arrive with your Starlink, wifi router, power
>> supply, cables and mounting tripod. For more information or to cancel your
>> order, sign in to your account.
>> SIGN IN TO MY ACCOUNT
>> <https://auth.starlink.com/set-password?code=0e9b9715-febd-4078-a1d6-80b5090ca182>
>>
>> Space Exploration Technologies Corp | 1 Rocket Road, Hawthorne, CA 90250
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/1+Rocket+Road,+Hawthorne,+CA+90250?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>
>> Questions? See Starlink FAQs <https://www.starlink.com/faq>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Starlink mailing list
>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>>
>

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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Nathan Owens]

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Cutting the data rate probably has implications on the transmit side, i
imagine that may complicate things.

Given it’s possible to make a long battery life short-burst-data iridium
device, it certainly seems in the realm of possibility, but no phased array
or high bandwidth there.


The dish takes about 20-30min on first boot, that may have included a
software update. If it’s not moved, reboots seem fairly quick, software
update took it down for under 5min. The OS boot is probably not the slow
part - I assume a lot of RF magic to find and track the sats.

On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 8:04 PM Dave Taht <davet@teklibre.net> wrote:

>
>
> On Jun 24, 2021, at 6:36 PM, Nathan Owens <nathan@nathan.io> wrote:
>
> *pre-ordered (so much confusion about this on Reddit)
>
> The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw.
>
>
> One of the things we worked on in the make-wifi-fast project was combined
> power and rate control.
>
> My guess is that if all you want is 2Mbit service you can cut the power
> requirements enormously.
>
> Might pull more in snow melt mode
>
>
> One of my unanswered questions is how long does it take to power up and
> start transferring data?
>
> I’ve worked on linux fast boot (sub second boot times) - in the past. Most
> seem to have forgotten how to do that (sigh) and have boot times measured
> in minutes. One reason why I like openwrt so much is it boots in seconds -
> totally bound by the pathetically slow NAND or NOR chips other people
> insist on using still. With some work you can also get rid of the friggin
> bootloader, also.
>
> My initial model for the marine market and for one of my clients is very
> different from how most use the internet today as an always on service.
>
> In this case I just need to get on a couple times a day, download my
> email, grab a few new music files, get the weather report, and get off. So
> I really don’t need all that much power for very long, except to surf the
> web briefly and make a ton of videoconference calls. An hour or two a day,
> tops.
>
> I’ve written a lot about “designing for the disconnect” in the past 4
> decades and I really kind of hate the idea of the internet being an
> always-on drug. Here’s one old talk I gave in australia quite some time
> back about it.
>
> http://the-edge.blogspot.com/2019/12/designing-for-disconnect.html
>
>
> There’s another always-on marine sub-project we’re on, though, that I
> *long* to talk about but can’t, unless somehow we can get the starlink folk
> to do an apollo 13 and fix their !@#!! bufferbloat with something like
> cake, or we can figure out how to optimize dynamically for it via another
> router hanging off of the dishy.
>
> tidbit - one time recently I was 10 miles out at sea, in a 25 knot gale
> and 15+ seas trying to write something down important, and I hit the wrong
> key and the !@#!@@ new apple M1 laptop  asked me:
>
> “do you want to install siri”
>
> "No, damn it, I just want to write stuff. If there’s no friggin internet
> why on earth do I want to use siri?”
>
> (apologies I’m grumpy today)
>
>
> —Nathan
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 7:01 PM Dave Taht <davet@teklibre.net> wrote:
>
>> I ordered my dishy today. It looks like a couple months or more before I
>> can get one… :(
>>
>> I have all sorts of cool stuff for rock steady movement compensation and
>> so forth on my sailboat here. I hope, that at least at anchor in pillar
>> point harbor or nearby, that it will “just work”.  It’s been a useful place
>> to debug and improve LTE and 5G behaviors for the past couple years.
>>
>> When starlink gets movement truly mastered it will be *awesome*.
>>
>> My LTE up on the mast is pretty amazing (I get 5+ miles and pretty good
>> behavior from the cake instance and monitoring tools there) but there are
>> many spots along the california coast (and obviously further out) that are
>> dead zones.
>>
>> The 100+W power requirements are going to hurt though! I just ordered
>> another solar panel and some hefty lithium batteries.
>>
>> Begin forwarded message:
>>
>> *From: *"Starlink" <no-reply@starlink.com>
>> *Subject: **Starlink Order Confirmed*
>> *Date: *June 24, 2021 at 5:44:17 PM PDT
>> *To: *davet@teklibre.net
>>
>> [image: Starlink Logo]
>>
>> Order Confirmed
>> Order Number:
>> *ORD-972149-36038-99*
>> Service Address:
>> *80 Cabrillo Hwy N, Half Moon Bay, CA 94019, USA
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+Cabrillo+Hwy+N,+Half+Moon+Bay,+CA+94019,+USA?entry=gmail&source=g>*
>> Shipping Address:
>> *80 CABRILLO HWY N STE Q
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80+CABRILLO+HWY+N+STE+Q?entry=gmail&source=g>,
>> PMB 404, HALF MOON BAY, CA, 94019-1650, US*
>>
>> Starlink is targeting coverage in your area in mid to late 2021. Orders
>> will be fulfilled on a first-come, first-served basis. You will be notified
>> via email prior to shipment, and you will be charged the remainder of your
>> balance 3 days after you receive your order notification email.
>>
>> Your Starlink Kit will arrive with your Starlink, wifi router, power
>> supply, cables and mounting tripod. For more information or to cancel your
>> order, sign in to your account.
>> SIGN IN TO MY ACCOUNT
>> <https://auth.starlink.com/set-password?code=0e9b9715-febd-4078-a1d6-80b5090ca182>
>>
>> Space Exploration Technologies Corp | 1 Rocket Road, Hawthorne, CA 90250
>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/1+Rocket+Road,+Hawthorne,+CA+90250?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>
>> Questions? See Starlink FAQs <https://www.starlink.com/faq>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Starlink mailing list
>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>>
>
>

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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Daniel AJ Sokolov]

On 2021-06-24 at 6:36 p.m., Nathan Owens wrote:
> The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw. Might pull more in snow
> melt mode

That is still significant. About 600 kWh a year, which would cost me 
about USD 66.

Plus all the electricity required for snow/ice melt - of which I'll need 
a lot, given that I live North of 60°.

YMMV, depending on your cost of electricity.
Daniel

Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Nathan Owens]

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That seems like a pretty good deal, only a small additional price (+5% to
the service price) to pay for the ability to get high speed, (mostly) low
latency connection where previously not possible. I think it’s pretty
impressive they got a phased array which transmits >500km down to 65W.

—Nathan


On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 8:16 PM Daniel AJ Sokolov <daniel@sokolov.eu.org>
wrote:

> On 2021-06-24 at 6:36 p.m., Nathan Owens wrote:
> > The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw. Might pull more in
> snow
> > melt mode
>
> That is still significant. About 600 kWh a year, which would cost me
> about USD 66.
>
> Plus all the electricity required for snow/ice melt - of which I'll need
> a lot, given that I live North of 60°.
>
> YMMV, depending on your cost of electricity.
> Daniel
>
> _______________________________________________
> Starlink mailing list
> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>

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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Mike Puchol]

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In terms of power usage, most of it is used to drive the phased array, in terms of each individual IC in the array, plus the computational side of determining what each element should be doing, at very high frequency. The terminal consumes more power in receive mode than transmit, funnily enough - because it needs to do more “driving” in order to create a receive spot beam.

The only way to truly save power would be to decrease the duty cycles, essentially, place Dishy in “sleep” mode for a period of time each slot.

Best,

Mike
On Jun 25, 2021, 4:32 AM +0200, Nathan Owens <nathan@nathan.io>, wrote:
> That seems like a pretty good deal, only a small additional price (+5% to the service price) to pay for the ability to get high speed, (mostly) low latency connection where previously not possible. I think it’s pretty impressive they got a phased array which transmits >500km down to 65W.
>
> —Nathan
>
>
> > On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 8:16 PM Daniel AJ Sokolov <daniel@sokolov.eu.org> wrote:
> > > On 2021-06-24 at 6:36 p.m., Nathan Owens wrote:
> > > > The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw. Might pull more in snow
> > > > melt mode
> > >
> > > That is still significant. About 600 kWh a year, which would cost me
> > > about USD 66.
> > >
> > > Plus all the electricity required for snow/ice melt - of which I'll need
> > > a lot, given that I live North of 60°.
> > >
> > > YMMV, depending on your cost of electricity.
> > > Daniel
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Starlink mailing list
> > > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
> _______________________________________________
> Starlink mailing list
> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink

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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Michael Richardson]

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Dave Taht <davet@teklibre.net> wrote:
    > In this case I just need to get on a couple times a day, download my
    > email, grab a few new music files, get the weather report, and get
    > off. So I really don’t need all that much power for very long, except
    > to surf the web briefly and make a ton of videoconference calls. An
    > hour or two a day, tops.

While IMAP/SMTP-SUBMIT let you do that, you could also run UUCP (which is still practical).
A local caching HTTP cache which knows how and when to override ETAG, and
can do some predictive guesses.  cake means that it doesn't have to get out
of the way of your videoconferences...

But, I think you want a rather small (bits/second) always-on downlink channel
that would let people call you.

    > tidbit - one time recently I was 10 miles out at sea, in a 25 knot gale
    > and 15+ seas trying to write something down important, and I hit the
    > wrong key and the !@#!@@ new apple M1 laptop asked me:

    > “do you want to install siri”

    > "No, damn it, I just want to write stuff. If there’s no friggin
    > internet why on earth do I want to use siri?”

Maybe need to send some Siri programmers to the backside of the moon for a
week!

I also had the idea of sending the Android team on a week-long hike in
data-free hills so they'd understand what it meant to be offline and still
need to have a map and email and ...

--
]               Never tell me the odds!                 | ipv6 mesh networks [
]   Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works        |    IoT architect   [
]     mcr@sandelman.ca  http://www.sandelman.ca/        |   ruby on rails    [


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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Darrell Budic]

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Better numbers than my pre-production hardware from April, I’m seeing my sense report ~87w averages with 75-110w being normal. Interesting, I see peaks around 150w this week with heavy clouds, good ‘ol ku bands being affected by the weather I expect. Last weeks heavy thunderstorm caused frequent loss, but no total outage at least.

I wonder if it would be possible to run less of the phased array much of the time, let portions of it sleep when it wasn’t trying to move lots of data? Definitely don’t know enough about the system to know if it could operate that way, just speculating.

  -Darrell

> On Jun 25, 2021, at 1:23 AM, Mike Puchol <mike@starlink.sx> wrote:
> 
> In terms of power usage, most of it is used to drive the phased array, in terms of each individual IC in the array, plus the computational side of determining what each element should be doing, at very high frequency. The terminal consumes more power in receive mode than transmit, funnily enough - because it needs to do more “driving” in order to create a receive spot beam. 
> 
> The only way to truly save power would be to decrease the duty cycles, essentially, place Dishy in “sleep” mode for a period of time each slot.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Mike
> On Jun 25, 2021, 4:32 AM +0200, Nathan Owens <nathan@nathan.io>, wrote:
>> That seems like a pretty good deal, only a small additional price (+5% to the service price) to pay for the ability to get high speed, (mostly) low latency connection where previously not possible. I think it’s pretty impressive they got a phased array which transmits >500km down to 65W. 
>> 
>> —Nathan
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 8:16 PM Daniel AJ Sokolov <daniel@sokolov.eu.org <mailto:daniel@sokolov.eu.org>> wrote:
>> On 2021-06-24 at 6:36 p.m., Nathan Owens wrote:
>> > The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw. Might pull more in snow
>> > melt mode
>> 
>> That is still significant. About 600 kWh a year, which would cost me
>> about USD 66.
>> 
>> Plus all the electricity required for snow/ice melt - of which I'll need
>> a lot, given that I live North of 60°.
>> 
>> YMMV, depending on your cost of electricity.
>> Daniel
>> 
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>> Starlink mailing list
>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net <mailto:Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink <https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink>
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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Michael Richardson]

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Darrell Budic <budic@onholyground.com> wrote:
    > Better numbers than my pre-production hardware from April, I’m seeing
    > my sense report ~87w averages with 75-110w being normal. Interesting, I
    > see peaks around 150w this week with heavy clouds, good ‘ol ku bands
    > being affected by the weather I expect. Last weeks heavy thunderstorm
    > caused frequent loss, but no total outage at least.

So... can we get weather data out of power usage then?

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>   . o O ( IPv6 IøT consulting )
           Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide





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Re: [Starlink] ordered my dishy!!

[Jared Mauch]

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I'm having issues keeping it powered in my remote location. Seems it doesn't like a non sine wave power. 

Sent from my TI-99/4a

> On Jun 27, 2021, at 4:07 PM, Darrell Budic <budic@onholyground.com> wrote:
> 
> Better numbers than my pre-production hardware from April, I’m seeing my sense report ~87w averages with 75-110w being normal. Interesting, I see peaks around 150w this week with heavy clouds, good ‘ol ku bands being affected by the weather I expect. Last weeks heavy thunderstorm caused frequent loss, but no total outage at least.
> 
> I wonder if it would be possible to run less of the phased array much of the time, let portions of it sleep when it wasn’t trying to move lots of data? Definitely don’t know enough about the system to know if it could operate that way, just speculating.
> 
>   -Darrell
> 
>> On Jun 25, 2021, at 1:23 AM, Mike Puchol <mike@starlink.sx> wrote:
>> 
>> In terms of power usage, most of it is used to drive the phased array, in terms of each individual IC in the array, plus the computational side of determining what each element should be doing, at very high frequency. The terminal consumes more power in receive mode than transmit, funnily enough - because it needs to do more “driving” in order to create a receive spot beam. 
>> 
>> The only way to truly save power would be to decrease the duty cycles, essentially, place Dishy in “sleep” mode for a period of time each slot.
>> 
>> Best,
>> 
>> Mike
>>> On Jun 25, 2021, 4:32 AM +0200, Nathan Owens <nathan@nathan.io>, wrote:
>>> That seems like a pretty good deal, only a small additional price (+5% to the service price) to pay for the ability to get high speed, (mostly) low latency connection where previously not possible. I think it’s pretty impressive they got a phased array which transmits >500km down to 65W. 
>>> 
>>> —Nathan
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 8:16 PM Daniel AJ Sokolov <daniel@sokolov.eu.org> wrote:
>>>> On 2021-06-24 at 6:36 p.m., Nathan Owens wrote:
>>>> > The newer dish model pulls closer to 65-70W, fwiw. Might pull more in snow
>>>> > melt mode
>>>> 
>>>> That is still significant. About 600 kWh a year, which would cost me
>>>> about USD 66.
>>>> 
>>>> Plus all the electricity required for snow/ice melt - of which I'll need
>>>> a lot, given that I live North of 60°.
>>>> 
>>>> YMMV, depending on your cost of electricity.
>>>> Daniel
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Starlink mailing list
>>>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Starlink mailing list
>>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>> _______________________________________________
>> Starlink mailing list
>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Starlink mailing list
> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink

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