From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from vsmx002.dclux.xion.oxcs.net (vsmx002.dclux.xion.oxcs.net [185.74.65.108]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3F45F3B2A4 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2022 16:37:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from proxy-2.proxy.oxio.ns.xion.oxcs.net (proxy-2.proxy.oxio.ns.xion.oxcs.net [83.61.18.4]) by mx-out.dclux.xion.oxcs.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 30A478C0325; Mon, 7 Feb 2022 21:36:55 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=dclux.xion.oxcs.net; s=mail1; t=1644269819; bh=RNvw8IXYwJwxsZzUU7FukxzyfbLgegh9wY7oeD1Wte8=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From; b=DEdQpqH5Lc9tmU0ijSb8z7OTVgHh7X1niXmoDS5svsjp87CuEBNJPW6mkEzOy3YgY GTOUH7HlRHx7Rozfnf6gXs/uwZ4EPJutJAWnUQTwW/adX0H9KKwbRiJaq9zlpidacH kYwsZrzmctUz4Zn24Wu2G7RpfRvdXgs5oLi1BOnKas0ASbkW53XUrj3Wjm7HqCsQ2J bRu0ny5yj+mFQ1KkfPrUMuncAmaCPBSqc6/CjK4hQtkWYCCeHRbGvYiJBAxRgVSnfg JwFI909zIk144/fxSjczoBm+ZvNtBLZUVKg+/dwf0MNPW+YiUdZDg2+NhyJdMqIcYM dY9u9sHQkSy+Q== Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2022 22:36:33 +0100 From: Mike Puchol To: Ben Greear , David Lang Cc: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net Message-ID: <8ecdc077-1751-4302-a013-fa35b2291a87@Spark> In-Reply-To: <431oq9ns-qnpn-n56r-6np6-374rsq317q@ynat.uz> References: <0d78acc3-1101-c7d2-c7a6-53158b8c1045@vdr.net> <44b2b090-457b-eb59-a75a-a0bbb0307073@candelatech.com> <431oq9ns-qnpn-n56r-6np6-374rsq317q@ynat.uz> X-Readdle-Message-ID: 8ecdc077-1751-4302-a013-fa35b2291a87@Spark MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="620190f6_7545e146_1d16" X-VadeSecure-Status: LEGIT X-VADE-STATUS: LEGIT Subject: Re: [Starlink] Starlink for Tonga? X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2022 21:37:00 -0000 --620190f6_7545e146_1d16 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Placing a gateway at the =46iji teleport results in satellites that cover= Tonga being serviced. However, satellite density, but most importantly, = GSO protection, take out a significant portion of the coverage from the s= atellites. They would need to lower minimum elevation (now 25=C2=B0 everywhere) to i= mprove the situation. With things as-is, Tonga would be covered by 1-2 sa= tellites which should be enough for emergency service restoration. You can play around with this on my tracker at https://starink.sx, I will= be adding the temporary gateway in a few minutes. Please not that the date line causes some weird issues with the map and t= he algorithms, which I=E2=80=99m still trying to fix. You can thank whoev= er thought moving from -180=C2=B0 to +180=C2=B0 across a line was a good = idea. Best, Mike On =46eb 7, 2022, 22:24 +0100, David Lang , wrote: > the dish aimes at where it sees the most satellites, not necessarily 53= . I took > my dish to a campground where there were trees to the north and it ende= d up > pointing straight up (Los Angeles area) performance was fine. > > when you power it on, the dish tilts and swivels to point straight up (= no idea > what the angle logic is), and after a few min of watching the sky will = re-aim > itself if/as needed. > > David Lang > > On Mon, 7 =46eb 2022, Ben Greear wrote: > > > Date: Mon, 7 =46eb 2022 13:18:49 -0800 > > =46rom: Ben Greear > > To: starlink=40lists.bufferbloat.net > > Subject: Re: =5BStarlink=5D Starlink for Tonga=3F > > > > 90 or even much smaller percentage is a lot better than zero. > > > > I wonder if they can point the dish towards the horizon to pick up th= e sat > > where > > it can best see the functional downlink. I realize the dish auto-poin= ts > > itself > > now, but surely engineers that can design that can also design an 'of= f' > > switch > > for that and let their on-the-ground folks do some hacking.... > > > > Thanks, > > Ben > > > > On 2/7/22 11:05 AM, Christian von der Ropp wrote: > > > But in practice the satellites won't be sitting and waiting at the = edge of > > this 940km radius. They are moving in and out the radius and the ques= tion is > > if > > > satellite density is high enough so that once the serving satellite= loses > > its gateway link there's another satellite in the 940km radius which = also > > covers > > > Tonga. And then this new satellite cannot be within certain elevati= on > > angles (=7E60-80=C2=B0 at 0=C2=B0 azimuth) where the geostationary ar= c crosses =46ijian > > skies and the > > > gateway antennas have to seize emission. My gut feeling is that > > availability in Tonga would be <90% simply because it's too far out a= t the > > edge of a =46ijian > > > gateway's range where there will be frequent service interruptions.= > > > > > > > > > Am 07.02.2022 um 19:51 schrieb Nathan Owens: > > > > The current coverage radius of a gateway/ground station with a 25= degree > > minimum elevation is =7E940km, so nothing in theory. > > > > > > > > On Mon, =46eb 7, 2022 at 10:50 AM Daniel AJ Sokolov > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > > > I hope this is not offtopic: Starlink wants to build a ground sta= tion > > on > > > > =46iji to supply Tonga with internet. > > > > > > > > The distance between Tonga and =46iji is about 750 km minimum. Th= at's > > > > quite the distance. > > > > > > > > What does Starlink have to do to make this work=3F > > > > > > > > Cheers > > > > Daniel > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= > > > > Starlink mailing list > > > > Starlink=40lists.bufferbloat.net > > > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink > > > > > > > > > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= > > > > Starlink mailing list > > > > Starlink=40lists.bufferbloat.net > > > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink > > > > > > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F > > > Starlink mailing list > > > Starlink=40lists.bufferbloat.net > > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink > > > > > > > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F > Starlink mailing list > Starlink=40lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink --620190f6_7545e146_1d16 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Placing a gateway at the =46iji teleport results in= satellites that cover Tonga being serviced. However, satellite density, = but most importantly, GSO protection, take out a significant portion of t= he coverage from the satellites.

They would need to lower minimum elevation (now 25=C2=B0 everywhere) to i= mprove the situation. With things as-is, Tonga would be covered by 1-2 sa= tellites which should be enough for emergency service restoration.

You can play around with this on my tracker at https://starink.sx, I will= be adding the temporary gateway in a few minutes.

Please not that the date line causes some weird issues with the map and t= he algorithms, which I=E2=80=99m still trying to fix. You can thank whoev= er thought moving from -180=C2=B0 to +180=C2=B0 across a line was a good = idea.

Best,

Mike
On =46eb 7, 2022, 22:24 +0100, Davi= d Lang <david=40lang.hm>, wrote:
the dish aimes at where it sees the most satellites, not necess= arily 53. I took
my dish to a campground where there were trees to the north and it ended = up
pointing straight up (Los Angeles area) performance was fine.

when you power it on, the dish tilts and swivels to point straight up (no= idea
what the angle logic is), and after a few min of watching the sky will re= -aim
itself if/as needed.

David Lang

On Mon, 7 =46eb 2022, Ben Greear wrote:

Date: Mon, 7 =46eb 2022 13:18:49 -0800
=46rom: Ben Greear <greearb=40candelatech.com>
To: starlink=40lists.bufferbloat.net
Subject: Re: =5BStarlink=5D Starlink for Tonga=3F

90 or even much smaller percentage is a lot better than zero.

I wonder if they can point the dish towards the horizon to pick up the sa= t
where
it can best see the functional downlink. I realize the dish auto-points itself
now, but surely engineers that can design that can also design an 'off' switch
for that and let their on-the-ground folks do some hacking....

Thanks,
Ben

On 2/7/22 11:05 AM, Christian von der Ropp wrote:
But in practice the satellites won't be sit= ting and waiting at the edge of
this 940km radius. They are moving in and out the radius and the question= is
if
satellite density is high enough so that on= ce the serving satellite loses
its gateway link there's another satellite in the 940km radius which also=
covers
Tonga. And then this new satellite cannot b= e within certain elevation
angles (=7E60-80=C2=B0 at 0=C2=B0 azimuth) where the geostationary arc cr= osses =46ijian
skies and the
gateway antennas have to seize emission. My= gut feeling is that
availability in Tonga would be <90% simply because it's too far out at= the
edge of a =46ijian
gateway's range where there will be frequen= t service interruptions.


Am 07.02.2022 um 19:51 schrieb Nathan Owens:
The current coverage radius of a gateway/gr= ound station with a 25 degree
minimum elevation is =7E940km, so nothing in theory.

On Mon, =46eb 7, 2022 at 10:50 AM Daniel AJ Sokolov <daniel=40sokolov.= eu.org>
wrote:

Hello,

I hope this is not offtopic: Starlink wants to build a ground station
on
=46iji to supply Tonga with internet.
=
The distance between Tonga and =46iji is about 750 km minimum. That's
quite the distance.

What does Starlink have to do to make this work=3F

Cheers
Daniel
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