From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Authentication-Results: mail.toke.dk; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=; dkim=pass header.d=gmx.de header.i=moeller0@gmx.de; arc=none (Message is not ARC signed); dmarc=pass (Used From Domain Record) header.from=gmx.de policy.dmarc=quarantine Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.21]) by mail.toke.dk (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E47B8706AB0 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2025 08:08:28 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.de; s=s31663417; t=1759126106; x=1759730906; i=moeller0@gmx.de; bh=eki9cpghK1I+nNnLUEdO7xRihv4Kv4HAwIC+cXCkEFg=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Content-Type:Mime-Version:Subject:From: In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-Id: References:To:cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from: message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:to; b=XcP9May1+O7O2qoDju0vcZxJ7Kyut47tQ4/1ts2J+VCEpbXt2vQRGl6UgB6s0lZH mi32Nyj7GTvWP5lJLIWxl8f4I63bj8H7UozjGY9nJhyRgVBQ0KjMNzPvGDVwJLQF4 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Subject: [Starlink] Re: Starlink Digest, Vol 53, Issue 14 List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: > On 29. Sep 2025, at 00:58, Michael Richardson via Starlink = wrote: >=20 >=20 > David Fern=C3=A1ndez via Starlink wrote: >> I understand that SCONE info about maximum possible bandwidth = (bottleneck >> maximum possible bandwidth, not zero, of course) available on the = path >> between a QUIC client and server is not to define a steady state = (although >> it could be), but may be better used to set the size of the initial = burst >> of packets after a connection is established, during the slow start = phase, >> to a value that can be more optimal than just a fixed value like 10 = (RFC >> 6928), which was updated as networks became faster (with more >> capacity). >=20 > No, that's not the goal as I understand it. > It's to tell the client that asking for 4K video is not going to work. However that is a question that actually involves rate-control and IMHO = it woukld be better to improve slow-start in general than to taylor a = bespoke solution for just video streaming over QUIC. > Yes, it might be able to get an initial few seconds of 4K, but then = the burst > tolerances (token buckets, etc.) of the network will be exhausted, and = the 4K > will begin to fail. I keep repeating this, but that solutions are already out there, instead = of the maximum signal tell each and every packet about the maximum of = the relative capacity usage along a path, now the sender can track and = extrapolate the change of that capacity and ideally exit slow start, = before over extending the capacity. > The video will then pause/skip/.. and the client will go back to 2K. > Lather. Rinse. Repeat. >=20 >> The advantage of QUIC vs. TCP for web browsing should be an increased >> interactivity, less RTTs to do connections, more responsiveness of = sites, >> less lag and latency, although it seems people is not really noticing = the >> difference after sites start using HTTP/3 vs. HTTP/2. >=20 > Probably the most important thing is that it gets rid of head of queue = blocking. >=20 >> For example, today, the following site was reported as recently = starting >> using HTTP/3: >> Pokemon.com (https://w3techs.com/sites/info/pokemon.com) >=20 >> If anybody made a survey to usual Pokemon site visitors, I wonder if = they >> noticed that change. >=20 > When I think about QUIC, I think about PsyDuck for some reason. > When I think about TCP, I think about JigglyPuff. > Or maybe Kirby (not a pokemon). > And, when I think about UUCP, I think about Thomas the Tank Engine. > Yes, I was a parent over the last 20 years. :) >=20 > -- > ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh = networks [ > ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | IoT = architect [ > ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on = rails [ > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list -- starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > To unsubscribe send an email to starlink-leave@lists.bufferbloat.net