From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wr1-x42f.google.com (mail-wr1-x42f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::42f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 789443B2A4 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2022 15:31:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-wr1-x42f.google.com with SMTP id bv10so9077465wrb.4 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2022 12:31:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Wc2Y89U2U9gyQl8xfIQMS1xK0E3ThSTZqoW2/5n9r/Y=; b=LlcwfB0AwdyzX5Woiwo4GzOGf/LJTdjNl0SbVljRcKwilpkWgTvLeTuM5q4jHMVS/o aU6pVK4Co8Q21pGCGekxqgB7AiuapYigFjnFg5xT+OKE/E1ZcojEi91GSywhS4fvlDEN YSJyX9Vz5L4XqnVY2/65dXVjuyg3w8RS3zlZ6ve4mmD5nV04j+tILf92Iuo71brFSunx lD/67Kuf4vPy0k1NNng31j0b/BHJRd2ofXxogoeu0Sszp/9KmkBP8Jyerwuf58RzU5Nw ujGAMvwZiVftnYSJzWraybYQUOg0w2yU8Ng+zkxuxfujjdkGoBqftC6icMms1NUp7ieK PAXg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=Wc2Y89U2U9gyQl8xfIQMS1xK0E3ThSTZqoW2/5n9r/Y=; b=FHu4RX6ttcvcINnPfqeDmfuwlNa2P9KtfND6hSwvcsrW4EHofx471ciWJdksve10Yd OCM7ZVAOArwvJPl4Wq5fZvjdSMabXuk8wu444yoHojaul1Ify81thmj9s3e0HARryvRZ 7lE+uO/Se2gNBHy+RsBJCHb3Cem0s9bvJtVQ9wtYGXQYeC/AE1/E5E6FzMDh8RQbtulA h/6i0iq2XJ3Q1pXEwKPPjHwt1FcDGLtoLqWgkVPj77iXSeF4Dod0HLzF720rWNef6EIH hxIhVAWax52UGae8JvdxJNkIwjglffdSBUsKqZDBJy4VW3JZev46bXCYC92heD/pALZw ElUA== X-Gm-Message-State: ACrzQf1ObRoGb0XnUF/yvFsr/Yc7ICZVfjJe7KIjsXeRQ8c5GizhS5pI OlXWvwIxoTKXzVt/qjSo98lRL0sxCmC1mCrwGa1zqDEBAng= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMsMyM7QxRWtaFDsL3uRY96Wjy8S+p+hsyW/OzTIr2dHjmHn/et7t9sMjmNaYVOQhDoOaeKtzBEOCodAWS/sS/FD0CA= X-Received: by 2002:a5d:64c3:0:b0:22e:57e7:6230 with SMTP id f3-20020a5d64c3000000b0022e57e76230mr4460768wri.482.1665775908217; Fri, 14 Oct 2022 12:31:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1665774889.392518761@apps.rackspace.com> In-Reply-To: <1665774889.392518761@apps.rackspace.com> From: Dave Taht Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2022 12:31:35 -0700 Message-ID: To: "David P. Reed" Cc: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [Starlink] The DoD "Transport Layer" X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2022 19:31:49 -0000 Dear David: Would it cheer you up any to learn, that 15+ years after the debate over UWB ended, that it's finally seeing FAR more major uptake and reasonable standardization, and actual working chips? It did me. I was pretty scarred by that mess also, and what was it? the 272 notches the FCC demanded be cut out of it, which swamped circuit design capabilities at the time... but not as bad as you. I didn't know until recently that it had hit iphones in 2019. and was part of the airtags, nor that the baseline latency on the things was 50us, with admittedly only a 1000 bit payload - Still crippled as to distance, and total bandwidth to under 10mbits, but, power usage is *amazing*. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-wideband The SPARK chips in particular have a nice looking devkit. Anyway... just as the swamp of ipx and non-interoperable email systems finally died... You can't in the end, keep a good idea down. Maybe on average it takes 25 years to settle on saner things. ... We have centuries to sort the solar system's internet out, and the more we can do to convince the next generation as to the right principles to apply to it, the better.