From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ej1-x62f.google.com (mail-ej1-x62f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::62f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F11CE3B2A4 for ; Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:04:04 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-ej1-x62f.google.com with SMTP id d10so11239364eje.10 for ; Thu, 03 Mar 2022 07:04:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=fXX86u7bsRFZBEKi0QG0KwSbZMZEFvMsoMpCALt0SSU=; b=kb0MM679FDFHWjBDjeKzbVC9Fkafn51bQvaSfqDtO6q1PydzpjMC4JyjO5xwImaXfO AGwEeTWW+tBCETyFu8U3TCwuBlIEhY1UrQOtPTQS7gloMVwnnfMWWZDVN8o/MyXd2T0x Oi2wAPb8Q+Jxz72lGRD3dkDRAKhpEDlKGrG/0XMrLL965+VVTu6MedVjweJdb5j+O9kO sCWrrOE6XV73ET2sJh6nZxswOPBRY8ji8loiYN26BstSEwBWW+mnp0svrS4K8+Rd93Pl 5lbxfwqmxmyZDFUCdgb0D2HMEDSsZwBOfezEVVi1GYfvv9b4dnSGn3J+rYMdE5qq5GmR DHEA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=fXX86u7bsRFZBEKi0QG0KwSbZMZEFvMsoMpCALt0SSU=; b=7zHR+HItPKziPCersLanU3cTXbHs1XOSFeF9AC2TgKXiI15CWUjPkESpIYQSEGAw2n hkUgMmkj9yyC8NEKJgcLfAYse0LWHddikGJEV0+DHibUNTvVPhWA5118SVeDDM0XUzMq CExgyDXcq8IfmdiYRzHyZHMQlUp2yhNn7rllDa4nGBiMqzW2ziP88n6nZLnPyjL2oZP0 FZ87LLvHkvedjcZZfe47qX1AixNlLoXYj4JuxxKXGlE34SkJmb6ehxJgWUdkiw397cx+ UmDBvB3xNr8UcX4K6tgN3VNtKG2fUmb1T8nIcvKN9uw4MvgroRckPx48FuIi3F25mWuX yjlQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533BKIzcgWdOi3ncmkvH8sgKkyQ3YNBqSCxXsSQwqH/7xrIzuIHd ELTjjZ/w02ZnuHRSpZXgTSlAHGIV4hm6u87h63A= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxi9MH7ndaa0fSNYYzW5rcF5Nk0fIFFsGAbIXre93RjbqqBM7eSQ+1WAM9lFKgTCqAXVsIIXfYoxx17UA0ep/Y= X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:7ea3:b0:6d9:4406:6029 with SMTP id qb35-20020a1709077ea300b006d944066029mr7780661ejc.262.1646319843373; Thu, 03 Mar 2022 07:04:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <234101d82f0d$56e94c80$04bbe580$@evslin.com> In-Reply-To: <234101d82f0d$56e94c80$04bbe580$@evslin.com> From: Dave Taht Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:03:51 -0500 Message-ID: To: tom@evslin.com Cc: "Livingood, Jason" , starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [Starlink] recent starlink rrul test result X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2022 15:04:05 -0000 There appears only to be variability in the baseline bandwidth of the link on that 15sec interval. The rest is just the interactions between our standard congestion control algorithms (cubic in this case), and a fixed length per packet FIFO queue. A debloated link would have 10-20ms of variability no matter the observed bandwidth, in the third panel of this rrul plot. The upload would have been much larger and flatter than it was in the second panel, in part due to the fq - (and with sch_cake, ack-filtering out much of the workload the download put on it) - see https://blog.cerowrt.org/post/ack_filtering/ and the download bandwidth would have been about the same (across each 15s adjustment), and perhaps better as when we crack 250ms of delay in either direction our protocols start to act up. On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 9:45 AM wrote: > > Dave, > > How would you interpret from a bufferbloat PoV? Or is there too much othe= r variability-induced noise to judge? > > Thankjs > > -----Original Message----- > From: Starlink On Behalf Of Dave= Taht > Sent: Thursday, March 3, 2022 9:36 AM > To: Livingood, Jason > Cc: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > Subject: [Starlink] recent starlink rrul test result > > wildly variable bandwidth, adjusted at 15 sec intervals, induced latencie= s of 400ms, really terrible upload throughput relative to down. > > H/T David Lang for this data. > > On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 9:31 AM Livingood, Jason wrote: > > > > When folks experience sub-par video conferencing over Starlink, it'd be= great to see working latency stats at that time - such as via the easy tes= t at https://www.waveform.com/tools/bufferbloat. > > > > =EF=BB=BFOn 2/23/22, 09:38, "Starlink on behalf of Dave Taht" wrote: > > > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://blog.tomevslin.com/2022/02/starlin > > ks-zoomready-rating-is-going-down.html__;!!CQl3mcHX2A!TjZjoTCGYO2gkt9x > > YrGdFrivrejHIdNjVe0TtEsCuQfDJTyNNy4u3_5CxlN2sj8WTA26WA$ > > > > -- > > I tried to build a better future, a few times: > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttp= s > > *3A*2F*2Fwww.icei.org__;JSUl!!CQl3mcHX2A!TjZjoTCGYO2gkt9xYrGdFrivrejHI > > dNjVe0TtEsCuQfDJTyNNy4u3_5CxlN2sj-yqmwsLA$ > > > > Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC > > _______________________________________________ > > Starlink mailing list > > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/sta > > rlink__;!!CQl3mcHX2A!TjZjoTCGYO2gkt9xYrGdFrivrejHIdNjVe0TtEsCuQfDJTyNN > > y4u3_5CxlN2sj_SP7yVhg$ > > > > > -- > I tried to build a better future, a few times: > https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org > > Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC > --=20 I tried to build a better future, a few times: https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC