From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ed1-x536.google.com (mail-ed1-x536.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::536]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 404DD3B2A4 for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2022 08:06:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x536.google.com with SMTP id v4so20946562edl.7 for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2022 05:06:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=xCNO7+Xwr991yo+h8t9UfB1dNWXvWMvkxsIbcEJxZU0=; b=gifK25EevlskRpHp+4pqeWQebjRLnz1SSoqA6QEVhsRH3TtPgAtEulLyxF7tloqDOm LzvYJ/NAUBXbNNGvWQr+3Pq6/TB4VwQ3iZDdC0lDHgWZhogV5XQC/EMgcZbNxsZaSjM1 sG9rMVUxkmynO/ny07rAcLBICjX5+m6O04OC8JsxnxxeKSkRhhZjpwOerlDwmskq9n4i /XBOS1EBe00eWFyFntai3Qt3Yt0EslNth8XwMAAPGPmxvNUpdbP5yjGLVKTmKFQx/X4G dYKkTBdUSvlVc+EE/839kQtw9/EaORDfCmYTV4s7W1csBS9DeVRj4C5zAewwTdq64ZKg 0p6Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=xCNO7+Xwr991yo+h8t9UfB1dNWXvWMvkxsIbcEJxZU0=; b=au1LYh8Q4MORlesbXn8y0vtMcuveZTU4oO3CTq5omQWJFQldVJ5q4haOcNuQY9uAFE jubnVc7dhrhCZ8gBtMQtAe9nq3kXJQrHZon6D9vGRtYUvQtB8YbDA4YWRDBGBoWlrc8X Sr1QnJpPT0HIdCYtkQ7OEEHTuOGcfxG+Wn/Zot6+wUQP09aCVnEnucCHg9iFWBmhcPLk +6VZaS7IuvlCdpPYcFNzK+v4wsb+9nBLw0X5RC1LnJ7Ie1ly5Y7uH2D4ZlMLxxWqWq5F JrCcjOcMuMAxVVD7NoPuoSCvOlUxRb4rYO2NSLho9nHDnpEfuEEapcR+tSG/GrnN03P1 LFbA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5335eOrl8ch9qBrXlkF6fRFVI+rY4OiE8FcmGBa7qA+l7zR6r0Yc jctiBHbnyb61x0YB0Uq/isOuAgElbnTQup3Uwis= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw9uMquLu5A+mhipjyLys9D3oucezXpnsaaByneToyBPiyjji24i8SGvswWsTYTMcOoLB0KVvD18+iRo1VtcuU= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:442:b0:416:14b7:4d55 with SMTP id p2-20020a056402044200b0041614b74d55mr16948639edw.183.1650369985822; Tue, 19 Apr 2022 05:06:25 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <0d78acc3-1101-c7d2-c7a6-53158b8c1045@vdr.net> <44b2b090-457b-eb59-a75a-a0bbb0307073@candelatech.com> <431oq9ns-qnpn-n56r-6np6-374rsq317q@ynat.uz> <8ecdc077-1751-4302-a013-fa35b2291a87@Spark> <380541e2-c5fa-b3ff-b28c-8d3d993be416@cs.auckland.ac.nz> <5d9dab2c-3c20-4d18-aa1d-cc72bf250843@Spark> <16b22115-3ec4-cdec-2cb3-ab03d75d9275@falco.ca> <866041e1-efaf-43f1-b218-6a6d73f6496f@Spark> In-Reply-To: From: Dave Taht Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2022 05:06:13 -0700 Message-ID: To: Mike Puchol Cc: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net, Ulrich Speidel Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [Starlink] Starlink for Tonga? X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2022 12:06:27 -0000 On Tue, Apr 19, 2022 at 4:57 AM Mike Puchol wrote: > > Apologies for resurrecting an old thread, but I had totally missed this p= ost: > > http://www.fintel.com.fj/pages.cfm/company/news/spacex-starlink-gateway--= fintel.html > > It seems the gateway was setup in Fintel=E2=80=99s existing earth station= , four antennas only, however, and the cables in surface ducts. No apologies needed, in fact, does anyone know how well tonga is recovering= ? > Best, > > Mike > On Feb 25, 2022, 20:12 +0300, Ulrich Speidel , = wrote: > > I've heard nothing further about teleport establishment in Fiji, but that= doesn't mean that nothing has happened. > > Meanwhile, cable repair has progressed a good bit. The damage was far gre= ater than originally envisaged. On the international cable, faults (complet= e cable ruptures and fibre damage) stretched over more than 80 km. The cabl= e ran entirely SOUTH of the Hunga Tonga Hunga Ha'apai volcano (about 60 km = away and shielded by a number of submarine mounts for at least parts of the= damaged section). Yet the Reliance cable ship traced one disconnected cabl= e piece end to about 5 km NORTH of its nominal route, found various section= s had disappeared completely, and recovered sections of up to 9 km at a tim= e from the seabed. > > A bog standard cable break requires two holding drives (or drags), HD for= short, to pick up each of the cable endpoints from the seafloor. It also r= equires either an ROV dive to check if the cable has completely separated a= t the fault position, or a cut if the cable is still held together by the s= teel. That cut can be done either by ROV as well, or if visibility doesn't = permit ROV use, by a cutting drive (CD). Any HD or CD requires the cable sh= ip to tow a seafloor grapnel / cutter device transversally across the cable= , so they're easy to spot on position traces. The Reliance did no fewer tha= n seven HD's in its eastern operations area near Tongatapu, where it worked= first. Visibility there was good (so ROV could be used), but damage substa= ntial. > > The ship then proceeded to the western end of the fault zone where reflec= tometer measurements from the Suva end had found a fault. Because of bad vi= sibility, they did a CD followed by 2 HD's there, then noticed that there w= as fibre damage along the cable to Suva, so reeled that in and cut the dama= ged bit out. > > They then proceeded to put a "mini-system" together. Let me explain: Enro= ute to Tonga, the Reliance stopped at Subcom's depot in Apia (Samoa) to loa= d whatever cable they had in store there. This included spares not only for= the Fiji-Tonga cable but also for various other cable systems in the wider= region. Reliance left Apia with about 80 km of cable in total. The amount = of cable that will need to be re-laid along the damaged international secti= on is 90 km (you need to allow for a bit of cable lengthening due to slack = being inserted when cable ends are being brought up from 2000 m (6000 ft) o= r so below). This means that the Reliance is re-using some of the cable rec= overed from the damaged section, and the whole "mini-system" will be one lo= ng stitch job. The damaged section also included a repeater worth US$230k, = which they were trying to recover and which was still missing as of this mo= rning - I've yet to hear from my contact as to whether they were successful= on the last recovery attempt today (they've left the area after three driv= es and are heading West right now. The rest of the mini-system was going to= be laid after the repeater recovery attempt (the overall success doesn't d= epend on the repeater being found, but the final repair bill does). I thus = expect the cable repair to be completed in the next few days. > > The domestic cable is another story altogether, unfortunately. This has a= blind stretch of 77 km at present, as measured by optical reflectometer fr= om Tongatapu and Ha'apai (there was meant to be a measurement from Vava'u y= esterday but I haven't heard yet what this revealed, the cable from Tongata= pu has two fibre pairs, one of which heads to each destination from a branc= hing unit west of Ha'apai. That said, once the international cable has been= fixed, the Reliance won't have enough cable left to complete the domestic = job, even if some cable bits could be recovered there. The next available s= tock of suitable cable is in Europe, around 35-40 days one-way shipping awa= y. They intend to bridge this time gap via satellite (and I'm sure would we= lcome a Starlink delegation with a teleport to connect to the international= cable, too, especially now that the Australian Navy gave them Omicron alon= g with their aid deliveries). > > I've been in close contact with our volcanology / geophysics community he= re in NZ, who know the area well. The story of damage to the international = cable is now shaping up to be a pretty complex one. What we know thus far i= s that it was neither the volcano's initial blast nor the subsequent tsunam= i that killed the cable - the outage began only well after the tsunami had = hit. In all probability, it's been a combination of submarine landslides an= d turbidite waves from a variety of sources that hit hours and possibly man= y days after the eruption. Finding that a cable piece has moved 5 km TOWARD= S the volcano points at an event south of the cable route, and the mix of s= eafloor visibilities encountered by the Reliance points at there having mul= tiple events from multiple sources. There have been plenty of quakes upward= s of M4 and even an M6.2 in the wider area that could have triggered slopes= , especially with an extra layer of ash on them. Turbidite waves can travel= up to 1000 km, aren't anywhere near as fast as a tsunami, and have long be= en known to have damaged cables in the past (see B.C. Heezen and M. Ewing, = Turbidity currents and submarine slumps, and the 1929 Grand Banks Earthquak= e, American Journal of Science, v. 250, pp 849-873, December 1952. This qua= ke killed 12 submarine cables over more than 18 hours). > > Meanwhile, there's still limited satellite service in and out of Tonga, b= ut I can confirm that e-mails (even with attachments) make it in and out OK= . > > On 18/02/2022 8:27 pm, Mike Puchol wrote: > > Hi Daniel, > > I added it after there was a confirmation on Twitter that SpaceX people w= ere on the ground to set one up, and also, as two /27 blocks (IPv4) have be= en assigned to Fiji=E2=80=99s capital, under the Sydney POP, and they can b= e pinged. > > Wether it=E2=80=99s at the teleport or not, unsure, but for simulation, a= n error of even a few km doesn=E2=80=99t really matter. > > Best, > > Mike > On Feb 18, 2022, 06:04 +0100, Daniel AJ Sokolov , wrote: > > On 2022-02-07 at 15:29, Mike Puchol wrote: > > As far as placing a gateway in Fiji, it already has a teleport > facility, which will have power and fibre (unless that one has been > taken out too?). Checkhttps://goo.gl/maps/6BYXf4R17yys7zNe9 > > > Hey Mike, you put a "SUVA (Emergency)" ground station on starlink.sx. > > Is that for simulation, or has Starlink actually installed a ground > station in Fidschi by now? Would you have positive confirmation? > > Thank you > Daniel > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink > > > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink > > -- > **************************************************************** > Dr. Ulrich Speidel > > School of Computer Science > > Room 303S.594 (City Campus) > > The University of Auckland > u.speidel@auckland.ac.nz > http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~ulrich/ > **************************************************************** > > > > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink > > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink --=20 I tried to build a better future, a few times: https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC