From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lf1-x132.google.com (mail-lf1-x132.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::132]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C97CB3CB37 for ; Fri, 15 Mar 2024 01:34:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lf1-x132.google.com with SMTP id 2adb3069b0e04-513cfc93f4eso1898059e87.3 for ; Thu, 14 Mar 2024 22:34:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1710480840; x=1711085640; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=faYGsRCycNReifDK0buGhVyXgybBfQyzEu5p1WWNb4I=; b=euzgfDJ10t4nTZOejHFrQxTAvvEZ6seYGYQLzHwEcqNb3DK2IV/e4HWfHoloIIJK61 dgk+ZCOejqdMqq/UmlA1hPOZ2hj9R6DrhAb2Fk7oxVJd5fvC+FvXfpERK1t6fj0Cm1hZ yyaLGlB6Ou0h03/Fy2jgSDYD03JxNuy8IFBybtGZwt01FicdoGzZ/s7W2BPy/matbbmV jKUigvgheFWEFuvdTmiS75DsNll6LkcePG/2Vj11E/4vGyNBgI20jc+py4r+dYEqteuO +NxDCgciEYcf4nHuSLOL05qN5heqst6vNJ66Rzy5KWHehlFLkGTWilmMqAgbXsloyIB0 4+Eg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1710480840; x=1711085640; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=faYGsRCycNReifDK0buGhVyXgybBfQyzEu5p1WWNb4I=; b=rfKl4GDvDXjF7TW5qrCp7TftJ6hSDU5pSJcSKDh2ODyoLWGTkDFiQYjlGJVlC62tnD oN6eT/pG8zu5lp7B/mFjTPhvgIJFzeqUOtiDZzrOKfRXY9bNFXREd3IxbSBmH5XhUgzT PPI+pmW9/ydaGP/Jaend895tEeKLhVNxSyanHduSpPe3ZikRfRiSi4h6MZ5yic8F2Udz I9F+kwedMrRCX/Z0sz4JMZZ4vbdwTUyVEDTQAyrwjLiaVYA7PVcgtIxHT3T1Xqmcqc35 zInk5J7g69R/w/CKWIUYqjNK1HbB/Abd2rSdoPaV0r5NJlMqkgu3OTdEB65WBpjFh7oT pVtA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yyi+F8VKFc0QDMSBLt0wOOCKbGmQFdK7LRw8mqiuYaPrC2OYmZQ 9F7yYxnxcsWstLsuGZABKA9t86a+H7BxaWZgJh0oPT/fVC8QeDi6kWYr1YrPP2X6xs7tx6/5EhA jGvx2MLaOyMjElwlmOVadufWY+DOiv+LFpHI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IH1rocE5+92e1qZLSjiV2EIo1ZCkJWEV7wjZvztk+1/pJyd+IcnOtDbLDFaOB2Lw0rZPgoXAN/i/WrmqjB+gd0= X-Received: by 2002:a19:915c:0:b0:513:49b1:f75f with SMTP id y28-20020a19915c000000b0051349b1f75fmr2460643lfj.31.1710480840404; Thu, 14 Mar 2024 22:34:00 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Dave Taht Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2024 01:33:48 -0400 Message-ID: To: Larry Press Cc: "starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [Starlink] =?utf-8?q?It=E2=80=99s_the_Latency=2C_FCC?= X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2024 05:34:03 -0000 There was a statement at the end of your blog post that I did not have privs to respond to. Honest question: What does digital equity really mean to most people? "Digital equity is a condition in which all individuals and communities have the information technology capacity needed for full participation in our society, democracy, and economy." is the topmost definition,but there are many others. We made a point, easily demonstrable, that a 10Mbit link with 1ms latency (to the nearest CDN) will outperforma 10Gbit link with 50ms. This can be shown by web PLT, and in the case of 1ms to the nearest IXP for a voip call, you also see improvement in user experience. I have now been trying to break the common conflation that download "speed" means anything at all for day to day, minute to minute, second to second, use, once you crack 10mbit, now, for over 14 years. Am I succeeding? I lost the 25/10 battle, and keep pointing at really terrible latency under load and wifi weirdnesses for many existing 100/20 services today. https://blog.cerowrt.org/post/speedtests/ I care more about MTBF and MTTR than bandwidths greater than 25mbits. A whole town going down, unable to conduct commerce, when the network goes down, where does that fit into digital equity? On Thu, Mar 14, 2024 at 11:53=E2=80=AFPM Larry Press via Starlink wrote: > > https://circleid.com/posts/20231211-its-the-latency-fcc > > > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink --=20 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DN0Tmvv5jJKs Epik Mellon Podcast Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos