From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-oo1-xc35.google.com (mail-oo1-xc35.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 941AA3CB37 for ; Fri, 23 Jun 2023 12:59:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-oo1-xc35.google.com with SMTP id 006d021491bc7-562f8262e0cso618728eaf.0 for ; Fri, 23 Jun 2023 09:59:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20221208; t=1687539566; x=1690131566; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=27rvZc6hOm0Baag3b8RukVO1NnOQMpIzlkd8sQ1qEVQ=; b=sF7yBXhjIEgJgwiniHqLCJ0zIRwMA4yD15eXFj6izHegPh0za4calVqr5aksCkzI7f dCI4OUPj90m3c+Q6gGyUtcm3jQKIBWiHMB4zNJEybNnR3jj1tYmrIs9gsDGeNPePCUqG CjSM3t6sPqZFUMRdh/QxhP2FPTIzkmhN/dFZwMOcwQ8c4+j0t+sArVynGt+14ACe+JYh Hy1Pw7WO9WYxQkcLAgiS54mBmDn6iUlpaICFJzBwoHnBd+hc3sJF4sKri9HHr01cxw6C Mk7A6f6e/htFmhk6A0lk9BueQaTEr2mR7/LD1fjlH03uAbB3bdVzchVoJ5Obcs9UpXVw NTjg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1687539566; x=1690131566; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=27rvZc6hOm0Baag3b8RukVO1NnOQMpIzlkd8sQ1qEVQ=; b=E90WIyDmN2os8MRSBuTwzo+xN5nuyRQ3N8nz/2z+hmU9baQ1XEPCSKlreKWz+n/+vO u68LBN2sRgnNzKG7eVkorlXEFlC3FQEKXw68Z47tT916pAvx8U0XviFqh/hmeYVMkQMl 7wIKEdO/pO4lPFhYNELq7NILEh6xp8D78Gz+mx/6Xg3/LprPhTgQdNaEpEWhad01AUpR 206KHNwiGKk734YWP2YVVJ5obYNA2njgVIl89J7Tksq+uDC3eznqDcFueVcYHXDBCGvm yd7+DlQK5y1WKz71YXecaXnLZYfRZL8M2Pp2C0Lf92zClfNwVaLoiIF479iPRew1m1tw +fAg== X-Gm-Message-State: AC+VfDxidO144hFzCaR7kDZN7dSj0AZ+ctAfhP8/MGvckoqb1WSpMLTo noaPcgEm/cScGSzs7yNg6UQXy9B5GiE7Bc7dt51/piNC X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACHHUZ6F85xrX/m6naCfucks9xU82Pn1iPTEjPOhYatYKu/8JyULUiYotqkZgOJNA9CWmt4oPhw+SnZfbxqjAsbJnwQ= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:f02:b0:39e:d865:3b6a with SMTP id m2-20020a0568080f0200b0039ed8653b6amr20770502oiw.52.1687539565816; Fri, 23 Jun 2023 09:59:25 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <0401A097-59CD-4A30-B853-04D1F3945DA0@olegkutkov.me> In-Reply-To: <0401A097-59CD-4A30-B853-04D1F3945DA0@olegkutkov.me> From: Hesham ElBakoury Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2023 09:59:13 -0700 Message-ID: To: contact@olegkutkov.me Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?David_Fern=C3=A1ndez?= , Dave Taht via Starlink Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000005d6eaa05feceec46" Subject: Re: [Starlink] Signal Structure of the Starlink Ku-Band Downlink X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2023 16:59:26 -0000 --0000000000005d6eaa05feceec46 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Professor Todd mentions that Elon had a tweet about it last Oct. But I have not seen it. Hesham Hesham On Fri, Jun 23, 2023, 9:50 AM contact@olegkutkov.me wrote: > > No reaction from SpaceX or Elon > > On 23 Jun 2023, at 19:15, Hesham ElBakoury via Starlink < > starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > > =EF=BB=BF > What was Elon Musk reaction to this research? > > Hesham > > On Fri, Jun 23, 2023, 9:12 AM David Fern=C3=A1ndez via Starlink < > starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > >> I think that paper has already been discussed in this list. It >> appeared in the news a while ago: >> https://www.theregister.com/2022/10/24/starlink_signal_decoded_for_use >> >> Regards, >> >> David >> >> > Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2023 06:17:08 -0700 >> > From: Joe Hamelin >> > To: Hesham ElBakoury >> > Cc: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net >> > Subject: Re: [Starlink] Signal Structure of the Starlink Ku-Band >> > Downlink >> > Message-ID: >> > > HGeGe39vAKTeG5RHBxSgioccOj+R4Nt7yeA@mail.gmail.com> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8" >> > >> > Most interesting: >> > >> > " VIII. CONCLUSIONS We have developed and applied a blind signal >> > identification technique to uncover the frequency- and time-domain >> > structure of the Starlink Ku-band downlink signal. We further identifi= ed >> > four synchronization sequences that can be used to *passively exploit* >> > Starlink signals for pseudorange-based positioning, navigation, and >> timing >> > (PNT), and explicitly evaluated two of these. The results in this pape= r >> > illuminate the *path to use of Starlink signals as a backup to >> traditional >> > GNSS* for PNT." >> > >> > On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 6:09=E2=80=AFAM Joe Hamelin wrote: >> > >> >> >> >> >> https://radionavlab.ae.utexas.edu/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/starlink_st= ructure.pdf >> >> >> >> Here's the PDF. >> >> >> >> On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 2:55=E2=80=AFAM Hesham ElBakoury via Starlink= < >> >> starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Has anyone looked at this paper (Signal Structure of the Starlink >> >>> Ku-Band Downlink) by Todd E. Humphreys ? This paper will be publishe= d >> in >> >>> IEEE Transactions on Aerospace and Electronic Systems. Are there oth= er >> >>> research efforts which try to do the same? >> >>> >> >>> Thanks >> >>> >> >>> Hesham >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Starlink mailing list >> >>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net >> >>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> -- >> >> Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474 >> _______________________________________________ >> Starlink mailing list >> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink >> > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink > > --0000000000005d6eaa05feceec46 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Professor Todd mentions that Elon had a tweet about it la= st Oct.=C2=A0 But I have not seen it.

Hesham

Hesham

On Fri, Jun 23, 2023, 9:50 AM contact@olegkutkov.me <contact@olegkutkov.me> wrote:

No reaction from SpaceX or Elon

On 23 Jun 2023, at 19:15, Hesham ElBakoury = via Starlink <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote= :

=EF= =BB=BF
What was Elon Musk reaction to this research?

Hesham

On Fri, Jun 23, 2023, 9= :12 AM David Fern=C3=A1ndez via Starlink <starlink@lists.buf= ferbloat.net> wrote:
I think= that paper has already been discussed in this list. It
appeared in the news a while ago:
https://= www.theregister.com/2022/10/24/starlink_signal_decoded_for_use

Regards,

David

> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2023 06:17:08 -0700
> From: Joe Hamelin <nethead@gmail.com>
> To: Hesham ElBakoury <helbakoury@gmail.com> > Cc: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
> Subject: Re: [Starlink] Signal Structure of the Starlink Ku-Band
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Downlink
> Message-ID:
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0<CAO0-hXar-KaB=3Dp=3DHGeGe39vAKTeG5RHBxSgioccOj+R4Nt7yeA@mail.gmail.com= >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8"
>
> Most interesting:
>
> " VIII. CONCLUSIONS We have developed and applied a blind signal<= br> > identification technique to uncover the frequency- and time-domain
> structure of the Starlink Ku-band downlink signal. We further identifi= ed
> four synchronization sequences that can be used to *passively exploit*=
> Starlink signals for pseudorange-based positioning, navigation, and ti= ming
> (PNT), and explicitly evaluated two of these. The results in this pape= r
> illuminate the *path to use of Starlink signals as a backup to traditi= onal
> GNSS* for PNT."
>
> On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 6:09=E2=80=AFAM Joe Hamelin <neth= ead@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> https://radionavlab.ae.utexas.edu/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/= starlink_structure.pdf
>>
>> Here's the PDF.
>>
>> On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 2:55=E2=80=AFAM Hesham ElBakoury via Starl= ink <
>> starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrot= e:
>>
>>> Has anyone looked at this paper (Signal Structure of the Starl= ink
>>> Ku-Band Downlink) by Todd E. Humphreys ? This paper will be pu= blished in
>>> IEEE Transactions on Aerospace and Electronic Systems. Are the= re other
>>> research efforts which try to do the same?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> Hesham
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Starlink mailing list
>>> Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> https://lists.buff= erbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
_______________________________________________
Starlink mailing list
Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/l= istinfo/starlink
_______________________________________________
Starl= ink mailing list
Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net=
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/li= stinfo/starlink
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