From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 084F13CB38 for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2024 15:52:49 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.de; s=s31663417; t=1710791561; x=1711396361; i=moeller0@gmx.de; bh=uQVJbGGVVlkHMfBWCWVNMqR2H3B3vDcFpF9zuMZkirg=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References: To; b=SeBhOUsZ/XJee8NMt6jq2sP4FVj74t4/0bHRMgZoghELAqDYaU0g5u7tOzIh3FwO bRNkXCorUexq7i2+NEO/jeqTun8zy6YHvv3FSGkXZWMebm1fWR6dRFBN4lHn66q0d 2hoqcnQsS8ay8gCKA5q7A6gNx5cGLit1QwQV0bspCkJwnOwpXETDw62t4nbmSTpMk y/+mE9yD6Q89uzTipg3K3WDsQ57140dM9KqJLjm/vK4bGmizU/2PdoYUOSaoHfANO J3Hxd/XGmlzPC+n19scn6OmTnT1V6ZNOIUmZjgYHel51icwqWCX5R9yo9VxyWtbWF 4iZZjGK5NFHc7ncJVg== X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a Received: from smtpclient.apple ([77.6.75.102]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx104 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MXGr8-1rH2Pv1BDq-00YekN; Mon, 18 Mar 2024 20:52:41 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.500.171.1.1\)) From: Sebastian Moeller In-Reply-To: <8s587854-5233-porp-0qrs-6s7ro5093494@ynat.uz> Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2024 20:52:29 +0100 Cc: Colin_Higbie , "starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <8s587854-5233-porp-0qrs-6s7ro5093494@ynat.uz> To: David Lang X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.500.171.1.1) X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:v10n8ugjnmazLUsZ2VcsL0Je434ioPMeVDpEFSU2sCVEKtnYFSE hB3/Tnyq87NGnlB9TqqIiANr/8eedYXtGtCFAzQQQ7InUEqouZGucPlT96HyaSjVJ64Monn uKpfow1+3FzbA1R/JNfmF+OyZYC/khHwmQb6ortyejJufiWDuwWiGR5XHkkY5+flCeT77N0 r28KAVrqB9U7UAqTkDmTw== X-Spam-Flag: NO UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:O09jQuv9eds=;8ZXnJ1MtTCpLPSBbj20s2AKBRGM Lt/544c3Tonp++5VUalXIEw/60NElfJgUwz4N6vl+5SPjAOI6B1jsP6Xyy3TQkS9nJZH91ip+ 36OM5RSZDjMF5dOFTFkcnMvfOagFhRlLq3piuk6bs5L5b923X3CSCaknnQP94bYUsUMLWcY4Q VeXL0z6n2Qm8ZPK6xRVkSxz2k0O2MoCxcZf9EuKRU/HuZJ7ltULzLaAYMc2IrUEQrVu4LfNaP XgzhkBh4ySSV5HHe0HdZpVJOwOWInsqjlJpbQIGRdE+wPRWREAZSvRgz/llYha76lKl3XMY5h 8LwgZ5VCJr2fsz0mkbm1yo0Ho/SM4AlKT6f1qaW5c9TfjSkktVQi0ymuwIljD/b/1jFTfux7W Lhl8DZpe7BzFSOipP74SKYT6WO284MxF4q00DdxEeism9FMO8D0MUim6RL5soktBxm2pSdAFK O2t51dAvLj7QC20+MNbXr7mN53dABVlJSqaiz0CG7g6/fVp+HwrwM/NM9ZzACdvEBJkmKKe78 ahgspWgmgT348ek5jQSBBy9KHsFFlueQ4+hIEsXXsM831Tj2j9lu5ER7pHuuQitssIYKO7lgY EN77eBXvRk1DGyWwJEQOQkRbELNtVIc5NIfLpE/yPEMNO4/2LqhHPIcO3MqGkPLnVlx0IIH/0 Orvlz5B73nnmTI3/0nsXyTvrBWs/g90Yg+veZOVUG78pXzG0lvUqk31gQ8XYLkB/OIgHFxEpS 4LTirgKX1TUAenNI+wvAaYNrYzP1d5460evTnRlvnvdBU65I3T4wf9rNrDYB1IGrgDdQyv5i7 dGOFD6sXQoQbcc/A86quIp9QuFDCyuFlqpaEiZ0U/DWwY= Subject: Re: [Starlink] =?utf-8?q?Sidebar_to_It=E2=80=99s_the_Latency=2C_FCC?= =?utf-8?q?=3A_Measure_it=3F?= X-BeenThere: starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Starlink has bufferbloat. Bad." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2024 19:52:50 -0000 Hi David, > On 18. Mar 2024, at 20:32, David Lang via Starlink = wrote: >=20 > On Mon, 18 Mar 2024, Colin_Higbie via Starlink wrote: >=20 >> Will that 25Mbps requirement change in the future? Probably. It will = probably go up even though 4K HDR streaming will probably be achievable = with less bandwidth in the future due to further improvements in = compression algorithms. This is because, yeah, eventually maybe 8K or = higher resolutions will be a standard, or maybe there will be a higher = bit depth HDR (that seems slightly more likely to me). It's not at all = clear though that's the case. At some point, you reach a state where = there is no benefit to higher resolutions. Phones hit that point a few = years ago and have stopped moving to higher resolution displays. There = is currently 0% of content from any major provider that's in 8K (just = some experimental YouTube videos), and a person viewing 8K would be = unlikely to report any visual advantage over 4K (SD -> HD is huge, HD -> = 4K is noticeable, 4K -> 8K is imperceptible for camera-recording scenes = on any standard size viewing experience). >=20 > I'll point out that professional still cameras (DSLRs and the new = mirrorless ones) also seem to have stalled with the top-of-the-line = Canon and Nikon topping out at around 20-24 mp (after selling some = models that went to 30p or so), Sony has some models at 45 mp. One of the issues is cost, Zour sensor pixels need to be large = enough to capture a sufficient amount of photons in a short enough = amount of time to be useful, and that puts a (soft) lower limit on how = small you can make your pixels... Once your divided up your sensor are = into the smalles reasonable pixel size all you can do iso is increase = sensor size and hence cost... especially if I am correct in assuming = that at one point you also need to increase the diameter of your optics = to "feed" the sensor properly. At which point it is not only cost but = also size... Regards Sebastian >=20 > 8k video is in the ballpark of 30mp >=20 > David Lang > _______________________________________________ > Starlink mailing list > Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink