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From: "Livingood, Jason" <Jason_Livingood@comcast.com>
To: "David P. Reed" <dpreed@deepplum.com>,
	"starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net" <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Cc: "mike.reynolds@netforecast.com" <mike.reynolds@netforecast.com>
Subject: Re: [Starlink] Researchers Seeking Probe Volunteers in USA
Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2023 14:44:18 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <F4CA66DA-516C-438A-8D8A-5F172E5DFA75@cable.comcast.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1672786712.106922180@apps.rackspace.com>

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> Those of us here, like me and Dave Taht, who have measured the big elephants in the room (esp. for Starlink) like "lag under load" and "fairness with respect to competing traffic on the same <link>" probably were not consulted, if the goal is "little burden on your available bandwidth".



I don’t have specifics for their test config, but most of the platforms would determine ‘little burden’ by looking for cross traffic (aka user demand on the connection) and if it is non-existent/low then running tests that can highly utilize the link capacity – whether for a working latency test or whatever.



> Frankly, I expect the results will be treated like other "quality metrics" - J.D. Power comes to mind from consulting experience in the automotive industry - and be cherry-picked to distort the results.



I dunno – I think the research & measurement community seems to be coalescing around certain types of working latency / responsiveness measures as being pretty good & predictive of real end user application QoE.



> By all means participate if you want, but I suspect that the "raw data" will not be made available, and looking at the existing reports, it will be hard to extract meaningful comparisons relevant to real user experience at the test sites.



Not sure if the raw data will be available. Even if not, they may publish the parameters of the tests themselves.



JL

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  reply	other threads:[~2023-01-09 14:44 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 175+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <mailman.2651.1672779463.1281.starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>
2023-01-03 22:58 ` David P. Reed
2023-01-09 14:44   ` Livingood, Jason [this message]
2023-01-09 15:26     ` Dave Taht
2023-01-09 17:00       ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-01-09 17:04       ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] " Jeremy Austin
2023-01-09 18:33         ` Dave Taht
2023-01-09 19:06           ` David Collier-Brown
2023-01-09 18:54       ` [Starlink] [EXTERNAL] " Livingood, Jason
2023-01-09 19:19         ` [Starlink] [Rpm] " rjmcmahon
2023-01-09 19:56           ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] " dan
2023-01-09 21:00             ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-13 10:02             ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [LibreQoS] " Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 15:08               ` Jeremy Austin
2023-03-13 15:50                 ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 16:06                   ` [Starlink] [Bloat] " Dave Taht
2023-03-13 16:19                     ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 16:12                   ` [Starlink] " dan
2023-03-13 16:36                     ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 17:26                       ` dan
2023-03-13 17:37                         ` Jeremy Austin
2023-03-13 18:34                           ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 18:14                         ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 18:42                           ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-13 18:51                             ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 19:32                               ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-13 20:00                                 ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 20:28                                   ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-14  4:27                                     ` [Starlink] On FiWi rjmcmahon
2023-03-14 11:10                                       ` Mike Puchol
2023-03-14 16:54                                         ` [Starlink] [Rpm] " Robert McMahon
2023-03-14 17:06                                           ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-14 17:11                                             ` [Starlink] [Bloat] " Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-14 17:35                                               ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-14 17:54                                                 ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] " dan
2023-03-14 18:14                                                   ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-14 19:18                                                     ` dan
2023-03-14 19:30                                                       ` [Starlink] [Bloat] [LibreQoS] " Dave Taht
2023-03-14 20:06                                                         ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-14 19:30                                                       ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] [Bloat] " rjmcmahon
2023-03-14 23:30                                                         ` Bruce Perens
2023-03-15  0:11                                                           ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-15  5:20                                                             ` Bruce Perens
     [not found]                                                               ` <CALQXh-PUgix7ApkTi5W8TMKVZfE4fyNk4WeiocZ6QU6R-m7naA@mail.gmail.com>
2023-03-15 17:05                                                                 ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [LibreQoS] [Bloat] " Bruce Perens
2023-03-15 17:44                                                                   ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-15 19:22                                                                   ` [Starlink] [Bloat] [Rpm] [LibreQoS] " David Lang
2023-03-15 17:32                                                               ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] [Bloat] [Rpm] " rjmcmahon
2023-03-15 17:42                                                                 ` dan
2023-03-15 18:03                                                                   ` Mike Puchol
2023-03-15 19:33                                                                   ` [Starlink] [Bloat] [LibreQoS] " David Lang
2023-03-15 19:39                                                                     ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [Bloat] [LibreQoS] " Dave Taht
2023-03-15 21:52                                                                       ` David Lang
2023-03-15 22:04                                                                         ` Dave Taht
2023-03-15 22:08                                                                           ` dan
2023-03-15 17:43                                                                 ` [Starlink] [Bloat] [LibreQoS] [Rpm] " Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-15 17:49                                                                   ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-15 17:53                                                                     ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [Bloat] [LibreQoS] " Dave Taht
2023-03-15 17:59                                                                       ` dan
2023-03-15 19:39                                                                       ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-17 16:38                                         ` [Starlink] [Rpm] " Dave Taht
2023-03-17 18:21                                           ` Mike Puchol
2023-03-17 19:01                                           ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-17 19:19                                             ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-17 20:37                                               ` Bruce Perens
2023-03-17 20:57                                                 ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-17 22:50                                                   ` Bruce Perens
2023-03-18 18:18                                                     ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-18 19:57                                                       ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] " dan
2023-03-18 20:40                                                         ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-19 10:26                                                           ` Michael Richardson
2023-03-19 21:00                                                             ` [Starlink] On metrics rjmcmahon
2023-03-20  0:26                                                               ` dan
2023-03-20  3:03                                                                 ` David Lang
     [not found]                                                             ` <CAJUtOOgC8O2jvT7eZ0O8nU8kCPOeCgVPTBNKaA3ZqLpJf4obJw@mail.gmail.com>
2023-03-20 21:28                                                               ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [LibreQoS] On FiWi dan
     [not found]                                                                 ` <CAJUtOOhPsiC=9SM3rUUxWuh4euLbDxVqcrM6hioDykZaWYfy6Q@mail.gmail.com>
2023-03-20 22:02                                                                   ` [Starlink] On FiWi power envelope rjmcmahon
2023-03-20 23:47                                                                     ` Bruce Perens
2023-03-21  0:10                                                                 ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [LibreQoS] On FiWi Brandon Butterworth
     [not found]                                                                   ` <CAJUtOOhinMu4Mv9EW-PB7ef9EHWL3inpeABUqFt0UDAw47MixA@mail.gmail.com>
2023-03-21 11:26                                                                     ` [Starlink] Annoyed at 5/1 Mbps Rich Brown
2023-03-21 12:29                                                                     ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [LibreQoS] On FiWi Brandon Butterworth
2023-03-21 12:30                                                                   ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-21 17:42                                                                     ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-21 18:08                                                                       ` rjmcmahon
     [not found]                                                                         ` <CAJUtOOiMk+PBK2ZRFsZA8EFEgqfHY3Zpw9=kAkJZpePx9OzeMw@mail.gmail.com>
2023-03-21 19:58                                                                           ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-21 20:06                                                                             ` [Starlink] [Bloat] " David Lang
2023-03-25 19:39                                                                             ` [Starlink] On fiber as critical infrastructure w/Comcast chat rjmcmahon
2023-03-25 20:09                                                                               ` Bruce Perens
2023-03-25 20:47                                                                                 ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-25 20:15                                                                               ` [Starlink] [Bloat] " Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-25 20:43                                                                                 ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-25 21:08                                                                                   ` Bruce Perens
2023-03-25 22:04                                                                                     ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-25 22:50                                                                                       ` dan
2023-03-25 23:21                                                                                         ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-25 23:35                                                                                           ` David Lang
2023-03-26  0:04                                                                                             ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-26  0:07                                                                                               ` Nathan Owens
2023-03-26  0:50                                                                                                 ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-26  8:45                                                                                                 ` Livingood, Jason
2023-03-26 18:54                                                                                                   ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-26  0:28                                                                                               ` David Lang
2023-03-26  0:57                                                                                                 ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-25 22:57                                                                                       ` Bruce Perens
2023-03-25 23:33                                                                                         ` David Lang
2023-03-25 23:38                                                                                         ` Robert McMahon
2023-03-25 23:20                                                                                       ` David Lang
2023-03-26 18:29                                                                                         ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-26 10:34                                                                                   ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-26 18:12                                                                                     ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-26 20:57                                                                                     ` David Lang
2023-03-26 21:11                                                                                       ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-26 21:26                                                                                         ` David Lang
2023-03-28 17:06                                                                                         ` Larry Press
2023-03-28 17:47                                                                                           ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-28 18:11                                                                                             ` Frantisek Borsik
2023-03-28 18:46                                                                                               ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-28 20:37                                                                                                 ` David Lang
2023-03-28 21:31                                                                                                   ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-28 22:18                                                                                                     ` dan
2023-03-28 22:42                                                                                                       ` rjmcmahon
2023-03-29  8:28                                                                                             ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-29 12:27                                                                                               ` Dave Collier-Brown
2023-03-29 13:22                                                                                                 ` Doc Searls
2023-03-29 13:40                                                                                                   ` [Starlink] Enabling a production model Dave Taht
2023-03-29 14:54                                                                                                     ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] " dan
2023-03-29 16:53                                                                                                       ` Jeremy Austin
2023-03-29 18:33                                                                                                         ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-29 17:13                                                                                                       ` [Starlink] [Bloat] " David Lang
2023-03-29 17:34                                                                                                         ` dan
2023-03-29 20:03                                                                                                           ` David Lang
2023-04-02 12:00                                                                                                           ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-29 17:46                                                                                                         ` Rich Brown
2023-03-29 19:02                                                                                                           ` tom
2023-03-29 19:08                                                                                                             ` Dave Taht
2023-03-29 19:31                                                                                                               ` tom
2023-03-29 19:11                                                                                                           ` Dave Collier-Brown
2023-04-02 11:39                                                                                                             ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-29 13:46                                                                                               ` [Starlink] [Bloat] On fiber as critical infrastructure w/Comcast chat Frantisek Borsik
2023-03-29 14:57                                                                                                 ` [Starlink] [LibreQoS] " Dave Taht
2023-03-29 19:23                                                                                                   ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-29 19:02                                                                                               ` [Starlink] " rjmcmahon
2023-03-29 19:37                                                                                                 ` dan
2023-03-25 20:27                                                                               ` [Starlink] " rjmcmahon
2023-03-17 23:15                                             ` [Starlink] [Bloat] [Rpm] On FiWi David Lang
2023-03-14 18:05                                       ` [Starlink] " Steve Stroh
2023-03-13 19:33                           ` [Starlink] [Rpm] [LibreQoS] [EXTERNAL] Re: Researchers Seeking Probe Volunteers in USA dan
2023-03-13 19:52                             ` Jeremy Austin
2023-03-13 21:00                               ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 21:27                                 ` dan
2023-03-14  9:11                                   ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 20:45                             ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 21:02                               ` [Starlink] When do you drop? Always! Dave Taht
2023-03-13 21:42                                 ` Ulrich Speidel
2023-03-13 16:04                 ` [Starlink] UnderBloat on fiber and wisps Dave Taht
2023-03-13 16:09                   ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-03-13 16:35                     ` Mike Puchol
2023-01-09 20:49         ` [Starlink] [EXTERNAL] Re: Researchers Seeking Probe Volunteers in USA Dave Taht
2023-01-09 19:13       ` [Starlink] [Rpm] " rjmcmahon
2023-01-09 19:47         ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-01-11 18:32           ` Rodney W. Grimes
2023-01-11 20:01             ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-01-11 20:09             ` rjmcmahon
2023-01-12  8:14               ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-01-12 17:49                 ` Robert McMahon
2023-01-09 20:20         ` Dave Taht
2023-01-09 20:46           ` rjmcmahon
2023-01-09 20:59             ` Dave Taht
2023-01-09 21:06               ` rjmcmahon
2023-01-09 21:18                 ` rjmcmahon
2023-01-10 17:36         ` David P. Reed
2023-01-04 10:07 [Starlink] " David Fernández
2023-01-09 14:50 ` Livingood, Jason
2023-01-09 15:45   ` Doc Searls
2023-01-09 17:11     ` Sebastian Moeller
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2023-01-03 20:53 Livingood, Jason
2023-01-03 20:57 ` Vint Cerf
2023-01-03 21:23 ` Eric

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