From: Jim Forster <jim@connectivitycap.com>
To: Sebastian Moeller <moeller0@gmx.de>
Cc: J Pan <Pan@uvic.ca>, dan <dandenson@gmail.com>,
Frantisek Borsik <frantisek.borsik@gmail.com>,
Cake List <cake@lists.bufferbloat.net>,
bloat <bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net>,
codel@lists.bufferbloat.net,
libreqos <libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net>,
l4s-discuss@ietf.org, starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net
Subject: [Starlink] Re: [LibreQoS] Re: Re: Keynote: QoE/QoS - Bandwidth Is A Lie! at WISPAPALOOZA 2025 (October 16)
Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2025 20:48:38 -0800 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <F9170829-9358-4D9D-8B23-199E54C102B9@connectivitycap.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <93519830-549F-459A-A737-792F18F3241C@gmx.de>
> On Nov 8, 2025, at 1:11 PM, Sebastian Moeller <moeller0@gmx.de> wrote:
>
> As a market realist (that is someone who accepts efficient market when he sees them, but does not naive believe in the fairy tales of the invisible hand of the market) I think that we would be often much better off with a competently managed/regulated monopoly than with duo- to oligopolies that are treated as if they were efficient markets... Infrastructure (and at least access networks are at least infrastructure-ish IMHO) is not something where the free market typically excels at.
Yeah, I also don’t think there’s an efficient, fair, market here that gets us what we w. In some ways, the Digital Divide is an expected outcome of capital allocation decisions by deregulated companies in a sector that has economies of scale and network effects.
At the same time, a "competently managed/regulated monopoly” may be as uncommon as Homo Economicus sitings are. Which example can you cite? NZ? UK? SE? And have they transitioned smoothly to new technology that would diminish the value of their existing infrastructure?
I recall that in the US prior to the .com boom, the telco’s idea of broadband was ISDN or maybe DSL or SMDS. They wrote many papers, had lots of trials, but did not aggressively do broadband, 'Everyone knew’ that the cablecos’ HFC would never work, and that they could not do digital and certainly not voice, HFC worked, and DOCSIS was a big success. That pressured the telcos to start actually deploying DSL, but it was too late, and the cablecos have dominated US broadband for a couple of decades.
Jim
>
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2025-11-10 4:48 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 20+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <9390D9DA-3C77-429F-A41D-E0FECD52FF06@connectivitycap.com>
[not found] ` <CAJUtOOjt+DajPifDNLNBOT_xwNWL_Wec5Gf_O91HMDdwpxtmeg@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CAA_JP8XOeSOqbZJPH=1_oWMD055vOUxHipxJMs8sbsHLu5MHCA@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CAJUtOOhiu8CVLARsiMKUkN4s87_VUr17su1Nr_4aManrwkCQAg@mail.gmail.com>
2025-11-07 10:53 ` [Starlink] Re: [LibreQoS] " Frantisek Borsik
2025-11-07 16:19 ` Jim Forster
2025-11-07 17:52 ` J Pan
2025-11-07 18:55 ` Jim Forster
2025-11-07 19:50 ` J Pan
2025-11-08 16:00 ` [Starlink] Re: [LibreQoS] " dan
2025-11-08 17:03 ` J Pan
2025-11-08 18:04 ` David Collier-Brown
2025-11-08 18:12 ` Sebastian Moeller
2025-11-08 18:31 ` J Pan
2025-11-08 18:11 ` Sebastian Moeller
2025-11-10 4:48 ` Jim Forster [this message]
2025-11-10 6:27 ` Sebastian Moeller
2025-11-10 15:39 ` Jim Forster
2025-11-10 20:06 ` Frantisek Borsik
[not found] <176262673045.1347.14550047629682790885@gauss>
2025-11-08 19:30 ` David Fernández
2025-11-08 19:45 ` Sebastian Moeller
2025-11-08 20:08 ` J Pan
2025-11-10 11:41 David Fernández
2025-11-10 16:01 ` Sebastian Moeller
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